2f9e8d5a No.3759192
>>3759172I dunno if I've 'found Christ'. I'm reading the bible for the first time as an adult. I learned about the nature of God though philosophy and now I'm looking for a religion that describes reality as I understand it. The Christian metaphysic is compelling so far.
I was an atheist for a long time after having gone to church as a child but was always interested in the nature of evil. When I discovered that evil was supernatural and personal that sort of compelled me into believing in God.
8e53f5d2 No.3759199
Still an athiest, but knowing that the jews despise Christ so fervently has me rooting for you guys.
73921acf No.3759233
Both, when I realized that Jesus was the son of a roman caesar and a jewish princess who was forced into sexual slavery at the temple and sold to said caeser and subsequently fled with a male prostitute (because you see the romans were kiddy diddlers and had forced this practice on the temples that they conquered) when she became pregnant with a possible heir to the roman throne. They were aided by 'wise men' who knew what was going on, lived in a manger with animals because they had nothing, fished because that is what you do when you have no other skills or background to feed yourself.
Jesus wound up building cabinetry in the homes of wealthy foreigners who were building fresh settlements to take over his homeland, the same people who had raped his mother and father in forced sexual slavery. So Jesus got fed up, hopped on a boat and headed to India and learned about Siddartha and Buddhism, the golden rule, the virtues of poverty and taking pity on the sick and downtrodden, and more than anything ending the line of succession that created wealth and power structures that had led to the destruction of his people, both in the power of the romans and weakness of his religion to resist them. So he came back, met a jewish rebel in the caves, who informed him that all of the miracles that the roman emperors performed to show that they were chosen by god were in fact magic tricks that were known to him, and so Jesus decided he would go out, use the Roman's tricks against them to create a caeser who was not of their official lineage, and to sew the seeds of popular revolt against the roman temple system which was essentially a form of taxation at the time.
73921acf No.3759234
>>3759172And then he met a prostitute named Mary Magdolyn who reminded him of his mother, who he married secretly and got pregnant, and faced the dilemma of already having the potential for lineage, and the danger that it represented to his wife and unborn son, and so he went to the temple, flipped the tables of money changers who would give foreigners local currency that they could then use to pay for prostitutes at the temple, and they hung him on a giant X cross which allowed him to live until a certain time at night at which point he was taken down, brought to his grave, and later seen leaving. When he was at the last supper and said that one amongst him would betray him, he was letting everyone know that Judas would be in on the plot. And then he took off, disappeared from history, and in the span of about 300 years the Romans managed to totally corrupt his message by turning it into one of their own religions based on the worship of Mithra and child sacrifice, and went on to create some of the most heinous insitutions ever known to mankind where they systematically molded christian iconography over pre-existing pagan religions and then murdered anyone who didn't go along with the change and submit themselves totally to this new church. And none of this has to do with any actual god, just pissed off people in the middle east trying to stir shit up against their oppressors and getting folded right back in.
But the modern interpretation of Jesus has no resemblence to the man, it is an evil, corrupted depiction meant to invoke fear and obedience and small mindedness in a system that is tantamount to people farming and all of the benefits of fresh younglings for old priests and youth pastors to get their pick from while they stuff their pockets and use Jesus to spread hate and intolerance and judgement while ignorning every fucking thing he said whenever it's convenient, because they don't believe in god or jesus, all they believe in is the devil and money, and your good book is nothing but a highly selective political document put together by men who decided 1700 years ago what was god's word and what wasn't. It was and continues to be nothing but a lie. If you want religion, there's your religion. Any form of church is anathema to the true Jesus Christ.
1e1ae945 No.3759444
>>3759387You don't understand how simple it is to actually make it into heaven, you don't even really want to. Some of the things that make it difficult to understand, are the lies and bullshit that are choking this world and deceiving the vast majority, and especially ones' attachment to those lies and bullshit.
Nobody that should matter to you expects you to start "screaming, getting hysterical, singing love songs, fangirling" - that's just your bullshit interpretation of the things you like to focus on and make fun of and sneer at, because you're not hardcore enough (yet?) to "Handle the Truth".
Yes, at this point you're probably going to hell.
And you didn't even put up a fight, but instead just rolled over and took it: Not much different to anyone else still here on this satanic viper's nest, including its owners/"management" and the many dark observers.
→ You guys are all going to
LOOOOOOVE the antichrist so much; and "scream, get hysterical, sing love songs, fangirl" him, listen to his sweet smooth words that'll stroke your every fault and ego, and even
kill for him! Oh, yes -
kill, and love it too! Many of you are even doing it right now, and already have blood on your hands. Well, you might have your short little "reward" here on Earth, but your eternal reward in hell's already waiting - hell's being expanded each day, it's quite the development project, no matter how much you like to pretend that you're not going there to fry.
13 Therefore my people are gone into captivity, because they have no knowledge: and their honourable men are famished, and their multitude dried up with thirst.
14 Therefore hell hath enlarged herself, and opened her mouth without measure: and their glory, and their multitude, and their pomp, and he that rejoiceth, shall descend into it.
15 And the mean man shall be brought down, and the mighty man shall be humbled, and the eyes of the lofty shall be humbled: Isaiah 5:13-15
https://www.kingjamesbibleonline.org/Isaiah-5-14/Spoiler alert: The God who you reject with such fervor is the same God of hell as well - satan is merely the filter to help sort out the good from the bad, and once his work is done, he'll end up frying in the same lake of fire as you. Oh, how honoured you'll feel then, to be so close to your idol and share in your endless searing burning pain and hunger
together for all eternity.
1e1ae945 No.3759445
Well actually - You're going to hate it there,
soooo much, but you'll know that you've earned your own place there eventually in case you don't yet already know. One of the worst parts for you lot must be facing Jesus,
and then your idol satan being the one to accuse you in front of Him, of all the crimes you have committed in satan's name, or just to spite God - and then being confronted with all those times you had made a
conscious decision to sin against God
and reject Him. Soo many wasted opportunities you had.
Commies/lefties/SJWs/satanists/etc. (and satan himself) in the end, will always stab each other in the back. But hey… at least you got to do lots of evil stuff, hurt/kill lots of God's creation while you still had the chance on Earth, right? You'll have eternity to feel smug about that, but probably, the smugness will wear off pretty soon.
https://www.kingjamesbibleonline.org/John-5-45/42 But I know you, that ye have not the love of God in you.
43 I am come in my Father's name, and ye receive me not: if another shall come in his own name, him ye will receive.
44 How can ye believe, which receive honour one of another, and seek not the honour that cometh from God only?
45 Do not think that I will accuse you to the Father: there is one that accuseth you, even Moses, in whom ye trust.
46 For had ye believed Moses, ye would have believed me: for he wrote of me.
47 But if ye believe not his writings, how shall ye believe my words? John 5:42-47
https://www.kingjamesbibleonline.org/Revelation-12-10/9 And the great dragon was cast out, that old serpent, called the Devil, and Satan, which deceiveth the whole world: he was cast out into the earth, and his angels were cast out with him.
10 And I heard a loud voice saying in heaven, Now is come salvation, and strength, and the kingdom of our God, and the power of his Christ: for the accuser of our brethren is cast down, which accused them before our God day and night. Revelation 12:9-10
Anyway… doggie day, etc.
(Pics unrelated.)
73921acf No.3759501
>>3759445Jesus would spit on you.
5f4c10ef No.3759503
>>3759444Side effects of this theology include scrupulosity: a variant of OCD that makes one obsessed with thought crimes.
Christianity is pernicious in this way because it not only teaches that thinking and doing is the same, but also that the smallest transgression is enough to have Yahweh torture you gleefully for eternity.
Quite a mind game, one that makes slaves by keeping one in a constant state of self doubt and cognitive dissonance. It's designed to make slaves of people, and the worst cults make use of this. An endless struggle session.
Many ex-evangelicals, including myself, struggled with extreme OCD rooted in that unachievable purity standard. It's ruinous to mental health.
a44f924e No.3759507
>>3759445Wow, your audition for the role of Doom Prophet Extraordinaire is really something. You’ve got the fire, the brimstone, and just the right amount of unhinged self-righteousness. Do you get a commission for each person you predict is going to hell, or is this just a passion project? Either way, keep at it—your dedication to spreading sunshine and cheer is truly unmatched.
Kike.
afe4d544 No.3759514
>>3759503The rebuttal to this would be that accepting Jesus is protection from Yahweh's sadism, but there's too much ambiguity.
Many evangelicals do the "once saved, always saved" and "not perfect, just forgiven" positions. They despise the idea of works-based salvation, and that translates to not caring enough about reforming themselves. Sure, it's ideal that they do so, but not required. So they err on the side of laziness.
Catholics are more work based, and require every sin to be confessed. That's messy too, but they have a different cosmology than evangelicals.
The heinous thing about Christianity is it ruins everything else. If you're not fangirling for rockstar Jesus, you're in the wrong. You might be saved, but you're also up against an idealism that you can't achieve lest you become a glaze-eyed cultist.
"Just had a delicious slice of cake. Thank you Jesus! God led me to finding a discounted purse at Macy's! Thank you Jesus!" This is how evangelicals talk. The mundane and profane gets reinterpreted according to the boyfriend Jesus narrative.
I've studied occult techniques for creating entities. I think it's psychological, but the process of creating tulpas and servitors is similar to building faith in a god.
You start by talking to yourself, pretending its an entity that's separate from yourself. You do rituals, sing songs, whip yourself up into hysteria to imprint it deep. Eventually you will start believing your imaginary friend is autonomous, and then it becomes so. The mind can repartition itself like that.
976df60f No.3759540
>>3759503I don't believe any "thought crime" is a damnable offense. When Jesus says don't even think about fucking your neighbor's wife, who's the victim? Not your neighbor or his wife if you never act on the impulse. It's Quagmire who suffers from his obsession with Lois. I think that's what Jesus is getting at. Don't obsess over the seemingly random sparks in your mind, but also don't let them grow into raging wildfires either. The fire of desire will consume you, and unchecked wicked impulses will lead you to wrong your neighbors.
>>3759514It's a wonder how so many Christians get this wrong. Prosperity gospel (rewards for good deeds in this life) is antithetical to Jesus's teachings. Do good for goodness sake and let the chips fall where they may.
"That ye may be the children of your Father which is in heaven: for he maketh his sun to rise on the evil and on the good, and sendeth rain on the just and on the unjust."
1e1ae945 No.3759566
>>3759503Are you
stating what Christianity is like or just sharing your opinion?
You crumbled the moment it became clear to you, that you're not going to be the one who gets to tell God what to do, and how
you'd like things to be in
His Kingdom, and that you won't get to expect Him to be okay with everything Earthly that
you'd like to bring along with you into
His kingdom, and that's fine: It's His gift to you, to reject or to embrace Him, or to reject or to embrace the devil (and his children/fruits).
You've made your choice, then?
Until you're ready to state your openness towards Jesus Christ as publicly as your rejection of Him, there's nothing left for me to say to you -
especially anything that you'd actually want to hear. It's not my place to take from you the gift(s) that God Himself had given you.
(Pic unrelated.)
b064f916 No.3759573
>>3759540Karmically, no, a thought doesn't carry the same weight as action. But in Christian scripture, it is implied. Regardless, your very best is "filthy rags" in the eyes of God, so what can you do? (the answer is grovel perpetually).
>>3759545What I'm speaking of is the evangelical behavior to make absolutely everything about Jesus, and how that makes you looney on the most mundane things. And anything you enjoy that doesn't have that Jesus overlay impinges guilt.
>>3759566Stating. I'm an ex-evangelical. It's more than just an opinion.
976df60f No.3759574
>>3759573But we are not filthy rags. We are God's children. It is important that we recognize this so we act accordingly. More than anything Jesus wants you to love your neighbor as if his life is your life. As if your fate is intimately tied to his. Because it is.
So many get the wrong idea. They look upon the suffering of others and think, "There but for for the grace of God go I." No. That
is you. In another incarnation. So do something about it.
In this life, you're free to callously watch Lazarus starve and beg for food and recoil from him in contempt. In the next, the tables are turned and you
are Lazarus.
On that last point, I don't mean you in particular. I know you know better.
1e1ae945 No.3759582
>>3759574>another incarnation>reincarnation>etc.Before I respond to Icono's airtight case for global Christian genocide later when I've had my doggie-sleep etc., I must ask you this:
where the hell have you been getting your "Christian" doctrine from?Anyway… doggie bed, etc.
2e71d264 No.3759590
>>3759582Who said I want Christians dead? I can't eat the fruit, but I still admire the tree from a distance.
eefa8359 No.3759610
>>3759609The one time Jesus ever got angry was when he overturned the tables of the money changers in the temple.
976df60f No.3759622
>>3759582LDS Church: Latter-day Stoats. It's all right here in the Book of Mustela. lol
But for real, I merely reframed Christianity in the language of Eastern Religions. It that so wrong? Sure, the afterlives of Heaven and Hell aren't exactly the same as reincarnation, but it's similar. And the term "incarnation" is used in Christianity to mean that God assumed a human nature and became a man in the form of Jesus Christ. Of course, I used the term in a broader context.
46c25ef0 No.3759736
>>3759735Hyenataurs tongue my anus.
75996068 No.3759747
>>3759387>>3759192You have to be a little bit mentally unstable to be a christian.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=-j8ZMMuu7MU 08708b7c No.3759891
Saying a thank you prayer is not the same as a tulpa
A prayer to s not a two way conversation as it is with a tulpa
e85a0f91 No.3759906
>>3759747Says the mentally unstable poster.
e85a0f91 No.3760142
>>3759747There is something wrong with you.
e85a0f91 No.3760143
>>3760141How about you just die and go to hell and find out that way and spare us your whining?
Fuck around and find out.
e83b6f54 No.3760150
>>3760141There is physical and circumstantial evidence
The most powerful evidence is that we KNOW absolutely true that Jesus and his disciples were real people that isn’t in dispute, what gets disputed is whether or not he was actually the son of God. For that we have to look at the circumstantial evidence. And the most powerful evidence for that is the all twelve were killed for their belief (Judas was a suicide but do you think he killed himself for betraying a charlatan?) you might be able to fool 12 people but would they hold those beliefs under torture all the way to death? No, it is effectively impossible to find 12 random people(who all have flaws) willing to die for a lie. Conclusion they believed with all their heart he was the son of God.
As for physical evidence more seems to turn up every day. From Noah and the flood(tribes all over the world have the same story of a single man and his family surviving a worldwide flood. And you will find evidence of a worldwide flood in some mountains where they find seashells, a worldwide flood is not in dispute.
And there are others including the chariot wheels found in the Red Sea, biblical cities who’s existence was rediscovered, every claim against the Bible of “we haven’t found evidence” should be “ we haven’t found evidence YET”
c6147ca3 No.3760165
>>3760150>Conclusion they believed with all their heart he was the son of God. What they believed has no bearing on whether Jesus actually was the son of God.
It's just what they believed. It's not hard to find 12 muslim suicide bombers who also believed very much that Mohammad was the prophet of Allah.
b9305ac7 No.3760253
>>3760165Islam calls for them to die, Christianity does not.
Suicide bomers die killing(and damnig them to hell), the apostles died trying to spread the good news and save others with eternal life.
Suicide bomers are told they have to kill in order to save themself, the apostles could have stopped any time and just gone home, but they knew it was more cruel to abandon their fellow man to eternal damnation.
cdb191a7 No.3760260
>>3760150Jesus was not white. Fair skinned. Blonde hair. No, only in white racists fantasies
e85a0f91 No.3760279
>>3760260The Son of God appeared before men as they believed him to be. As a beggar, as an old man, as a little girl, as a cripple. And when he spoke, all could hear and understand him no matter what language they understood.
This is in the Scriptures.
5ba0195b No.3760285
>>3760279But mostly as blonde, blue-eyed white guy. Even for shit skins lul
70bb3af3 No.3760293
>>3760260>>3760279We have accounts of Jesus appearance from people who were not believers
The only sources claiming Jesus was a brown man are people who hate him
75996068 No.3760294
>>3760279>The Son of God appeared before men as they believed him to be.Bullshit. That never appeared in the bible.
If you are going to follow a religion you should at least read the book.
ba0b3c69 No.3760298
>>3760293The Bible itself says Jesus was a Galilean Jew and was indistinguishable from other Galilean Jews. Galilean Jews were neither blonde-haired nor blue-eyed, you absolute clod.
1e1ae945 No.3760299
>>3760141>That's all I was asking for, Business Dog. Your personal testimony, to add to my assessment.My personal testimony is pretty impressive, but I'm not going to share it with you until you do a few other things first.
I've also noticed deceptiveness and unwillingness/inability to examine concepts on terms other than those taught to you, and I'm not especially keen on being led along on such games, even if it's a symptom of you lying to yourself first.
If you're still looking for those certain kinds of signs and wonders, you'll get plenty of them when the antichrist shows up. You think you're "hardcore/analytical" enough to not rush and worship at his feet by the time that he does?
You can fathom the concept of pure evil and loving ones' own enslavement and captor(s) from a more neutral standpoint, can't you? It'll help you better understand the world if you do.
The evidence that Jesus Christ/God is real and alive, is all around us - it's obvious (to me and genuine Christians). I'm not "upset" at you for not seeing it, most people can't, but it does make me wish I had the power to just "make you believe" - but that would go against God's will/gift of freedom of choice, so it's good that I don't.
Do yourself a favour - don't push yourself, it'll just frustrate you. Baby steps. It took a very long time for this world to get as evil and twisted as it already is, and even as a saved Christian it'll be a lifelong effort to untangle oneself from its snares. Most Christians probably won't "untangle themselves" for whatever reason and as a result, have a shitty life during their remaining time here. The "side-effects" of getting clean aren't harmful, it's focusing on the drug and its withdrawal symptoms that makes things worse. It was/is a strange road for me, and I'm eternally grateful for the opportunity and fair chance (that
everyone has received). Every bit of the "effort" is worth it, but don't let anyone tell you that salvation requires work.
Anyway… I'm on a bit of a doggie-break. More later.
e85a0f91 No.3760306
Some scholars believe that Revelation 1:14-15 provides a clue about Jesus's appearance:
His hair was white as wool or snow
His eyes were like a flame of fire
His feet were like burnished bronze
Early Christian texts and artworks also offer varying portrayals of Jesus's appearance. The earliest KNOWN depictions of Jesus date to at least two centuries after he died.
73921acf No.3760313
>>3760293Here's the earliest depiction of Jesus, so actually according to that logic he was an anthropomorphic donkey.
Furries 1
Christfags 0 BTFO
f61cd1f1 No.3760337
>>3760299
>You think you're "hardcore/analytical" enough to not rush and worship at his feet by the time that he does?My asocial personality prevents me from getting excited about anyone, let alone politicians.
>I've also noticed deceptiveness I need clarification on that. I thought I was letting it all hang out. Why hide the fickleness and sarcasm, especially when you're trying to reconcile your worldview against that of others. It's part of the honesty. You're not going to understand me fully if I'm masking.
>You can fathom the concept of pure evil and loving ones' own enslavement and captor(s) from a more neutral standpoint, can't you? It'll help you better understand the world if you do.Yes, I can understand that. I just don't want to trade one slave master for another.
8f268aaf No.3760360
if you are the keyboard warrior, turn off your router.
976df60f No.3760373
My take is that explaining religion to someone who hasn't had a profound spiritual experience is like trying to get someone who's deaf to jam along to your favorite tune. This is how it works. First, God's lightning must strike your heart. Then as you're left reeling, you seek out a religious framework to contextualize and provide a language to describe what just happened to you. What does it mean?
Maybe you want such an electrifying experience. I could tell you to pray, fast, meditate, partake of entheogens, read this, that, and the other, but there's no guarantee. There's a sense of serendipity, as if you were chosen. Privileged to behold God's revelation, but also compelled to awaken your brothers and guide them to the way, the truth, and the life.
Go ahead and laugh at me. God is laughing with you, but with a knowing, compassionate smile. He knows how silly I look through your eyes. He knows we will all laugh together in the hereafter. That's my conception of Heaven: we all get let in on the cosmic joke. All the sickness and suffering and setbacks and struggle in this life, it was all for good reason, meaningful, necessary for the plan. We learn how easy it would have been to achieve lasting peace, freedom, and prosperity. If only we had just
89a73e93 No.3760412
>>3760373You think it's materialism holding me back.
When I was 8, I had an intense vision of a roped figure performing sun worship. This was before I understood pagan theology.
Christians would dismiss that as a demon trying to lead me astray, of course.
aed12747 No.3760413
>>3760412Good luck overcoming that, seriously if materialism was a sin, God wouldn't have hardwired it into us from our hunter and gatherer years.
Seriously for a "loving god" he seems incredibly cruel.
703ad660 No.3760414
>>3760413Scientific materialism I meant. Not greed.
f0d95799 No.3760423
>>3759172> religonYOU MISSPELLED THE WORD, YOU GODLESS BARBARIAN.
You should be crucified.
976df60f No.3761168
>>3760412So there
is spiritual life in you. Not everyone has the kinds of visions you described. It's a blessing. Nothing to be ashamed of. Not demonic.
I'm reminded of a line from Captain Ahab in Moby Dick. If you'd seek revenge against the Sun for a sunburn, then you might have issues. But feeling gratitude toward the Sun is natural.
9a266e92 No.3763236
>>3759746Anyone with faith is saved
“This righteousness is given through faith in Jesus Christ to all who believe. There is no difference between Jew and Gentile,”
Romans 3:22 NIV
c8134725 No.3763268
>>3760413>God wouldn't have hardwired it into us from our hunter and gatherer years.Lol, bro believes in evolution. What a tard!
58673309 No.3763373
>>3763268Why do people believe evolution is incompatible with religion. Darwin himself stated evolution does not explain the origin of life only its diversity. It explains how dogs came from wolves but nothing about where wolves come from.
c844c492 No.3763408
>>3763373Not religion as a whole, but Christianity. Animals didn't evolve, they were created.
7853fef0 No.3763417
>>3763236>Romans 3:22 NIVRomans was based on a collection of letter written by Paul to the Romans (Hence the name) explaining the doctrine of Christian faith. It was penned almost 60 years A.D.
Much of what Paul wrote contradicts what is written elsewhere in the bible and directly conflicts with records of what Jesus was purported to have said on many subjects.
The entire book of Romans was an attempt to lay down a single set of rules and clarifications that would put an end to violent unrest inside which caused Emperor Claudius to expel Jews from Rome.
Basically Christians and the Jews were always arguing and fighting each other so Paul tried to write a unifying theory of faith to put an end to the bloodshed and terrorism.
7853fef0 No.3763418
>>3763373Darwin said that shit because he was going to be executed by the church if he didn't tow the line about the creation myth.
During the "Enlightenment" period it was commonly believed that evolution was the method by which God created everything then scientists figured out how cells can naturally evolve without the need for a divine hand. Once there was proof that God wasn't needed Christians went on the offensive and got all pissy about it.
63d51779 No.3763430
>>3763418When scientists can mix together some chemicals in a test tube, mimic the conditions of the early earth, and create something alive, get back to us. Decades of attempts at such experiments have always failed.
866ad32e No.3763437
>>3763430Honestly, even if scientists successfully cooked living things from 'early earth conditions' in significantly shorter time than few hundred million years, I'd expect that would not affect beliefs of majority of religious people at all.
Only the crazy minority are incompatible with science and many of those just go all flat earth on ANY scientific knowledge they disagree with.
0dca74d7 No.3763444
>>3763418>once there was proof God wasn’t needed…What proof? There is none
You can’t say evolution is Gods tool, also God not required.
It is fundamentally impossible to say evolution(or anything) happens without the influence of God.
866ad32e No.3763456
>>3763444Subjects of proof need to be defined in a way that is falsifiable. I do not know any religion which defines their beliefs in that way.
Assuming there exists an objective word of which can be acquired knowledge also is not falsifiable. (But it's in my opinion more useful than assuming there is no objective world or it is completely unknowable.)
4554269c No.3763501
>>3763444Our science is actually getting pretty good on the subject of genetics. We know how fast animals mutate generation to generation. We know how big the genome is. We know how old the earth is.
The math doesn't work out. The earth isn't old enough for humans to have evolved on it. Definitely not via natural selection. Something else happened that we haven't figured out yet.
7853fef0 No.3763511
>>3763444It
was fundamentally impossible to say evolution(or anything) happens without the influence of God. Then we did science.
Now we know better.
43e2962e No.3763521
>>3763510Did you even read the article? They “recreated conditions”, they didn’t create life.
You don’t seem to understand how impossible it is so Let me paint you a picture… using a cement mixer. Throw the canvas, paint, and brushes into a cement mixer, turn it on and in 2 million years we will pull out an Ivan Aivazovsky masterpiece, which according to you is perfectly possible because I’ve “recreated the conditions” by throwing all the pieces in a mixer
Your lack of critical thinking is concerning
d513eccf No.3763544
>>3763521> Throw the canvas, paint, and brushes into a cement mixer, turn it on and in 2 million years we will pull out an Ivan Aivazovsky masterpieceNope. That's nothing more than the "irreducible complexity" fallacy. The first self-reproducing lifeforms were far, far simpler than any recognisable organisms you can think of.
7540e079 No.3763576
>>3763566True. God can't be "disproved" by science, knowledge or thought in general because any possible set of events or observations can be attributed to a world with a God in it. God can never be demonstrated incorrect because it is defined in such a way that our observations of reality are meaningless to the concept. This is a kind of weasel definition from the theist that protects God from real scrutiny, but also makes talking about God in any real way virtually impossible rendering the concept meaningless.
2419546c No.3763583
>>3763544It’s not a fallacy
If replicators require DNA to replicate things and DNA requires replicators then which came first. Because they both fundamentally require each other.
7540e079 No.3763584
>>3763583Now you've just got your biology wrong.
RNA is known to be capable of carrying out storage and replication functions as well as act like proteins to catalyze it's own synthesis. We've known this for over a decade.
https://pmc.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/articles/PMC2652413/ 7540e079 No.3763588
>>3763586 It's not my fault if you can't understand how simplistic a chemical a chain of RNA is.
7540e079 No.3763589
>>3763586 You could have been excused for your ignorance about how RNA can catalyze it's own synthesis but I already explained that and posted a reference you obviously didn't bother to read.
0b812637 No.3763609
>>3763584Oh hon hon, someone has read Zee Revolutionary Phenotype le!
866ad32e No.3763617
>>3763589Scientific argument with a creationist is as useless as with a flat earther. But one can have interesting discussion from hollow Earth view with a flat earther. (And vice versa.)
I'd suggest using the Gnostic view that it was not the God but Satan who created Earth and life.
27b94e9b No.3763618
>>3763617That doesn’t work philosophically
To say evil created life is to say our existence is fundamentally evil and against the will of God.
It also doesn’t work because why would God create the universe without intending to create life as well? Did God just create a universe sized hourglass to watch the sands shift without greater meaning or purpose?
866ad32e No.3763619
>>3763618It's pretty evident that material life is not a perfect creation. For example pain, suffering and dissatisfaction appears necessary to protect humans from dying from injuries, neglect and unfavorable circumstances before they can reproduce. Why would a good god create that instead of purely spiritual life? Obviously the creation iof material world is a work of an evil Demiurge. Gnostics believed Jesus Christ only appeared to be a mortal man but was in truth a fully spiritual being. And that some humans have a spiritual spark which can let them escape the material world from enlightenment with help of a divine redeemer, &cet.
This is of course all heretical to Christians who are blinded by Satan and tried to erase all Gnistics and knowledge about Gnostic truth early on but maybe you can make them see their error.
(This is just a suggestion how to start constructing a rant. I'm not at all religious and do not actually care.)
27b94e9b No.3763621
>>3763619He didn’t create that, God created paradise known as the garden of Eden. The perfect garden was corrupted when sin was introduced by Satan causing man to rebel/be rejected.
866ad32e No.3763626
>>3763621For short summary of Gnosticism, see
https://www.learnreligions.com/what-is-gnosticism-700683To faithless me it does not seem any more or less sillier or contradictory than Christianity, just an alternate view.
And likely more productive to discuss than chemistry of RNA with someone who does not take assumption the scientific method produces knowledge about objective world.
7540e079 No.3763660
>>3763618Why not? The universe seems plenty hostile towards life. All the view would preclude is a fundamentally good, and at the same time all powerful God, or one that crated the universe for the specific purpose of having life in it. Neither of these things need to be true.
6cd56b7b No.3763663
>>3763660 Dear A I bot, You are to easy to detect .
7540e079 No.3763664
>>3763617It's always good to tell people when they are making a bad argument that flies in the face of the evidence we have. The idea that abiogenesis is impossible because cellular life as we know them would need to pop out of a pool of gloop is a common mischaracterization of the way people actually studying the subject actually think.
7540e079 No.3763666
>>3763663You usually detect bots because they are questioning the fundamental assumptions of religious people? They must be making really good bots nowadays.
866ad32e No.3763681
>>3763633Would you prefer to read kummaa molotusta, jota useimmat tällä foorumilla eivät ymmärrä instead of broken approximation of English?
>>3763664Like religion, pseudoscience is not based on the philosophy of scientific method. Preaching scientific knowledge to someone who KNOWS the truth because Goddess revealed it to them in tea leaves (or whatever) may feel good but will not convince them.
6cd56b7b No.3763682
>>3763666 no , it's because of this everywhere
0b812637 No.3763732
>>3763681Do you suppose there are things outside the reach of science or can everything be dissected, broken down and catalogued?
2419546c No.3763736
>>3763732There are known knowns
Unknown knowables
And unknowables
7540e079 No.3763741
>>3763682Calling me a bot isn't much of an argument. I just wanted to call attention to some of the assumptions people commonly make about God. Something we would call a God could exist but be malevolent. Something we would call a God could exist but not be interested in life. Theists don't generally think about God along any other lines than those they have been taught.
7540e079 No.3763742
>>3763681Convincing people who are dead set in their ways isn't really the goal. When I see an incorrect line of thinking that is easy to demonstrate to be incorrect it's little effort to point others in the right direction if they are just observers who may think along the same lines.
866ad32e No.3763767
>>3763732Of course not everything is knowable. Most of our expanding universe is unknowable simply because distance between here and there increases faster than speed of light and for that reason is not causally connected to us.
Dynamic systems like weather on Earth and planetary orbits in of our solar system will always be unpredictable in long therm.
There are plenty of provably undecidable problems in mathematics.
a44f924e No.3763854
>>3763749Funny how christkikes only try to point at others instead of "we need to remove pedophiles from church". Interesting.
a44f924e No.3763855
>>37638541. John W. Radcliff II: A youth pastor from West Virginia, Radcliff was arrested on 190 counts of sexual assault, abuse, and incest spanning over three decades. The allegations involve multiple victims, including relatives, with incidents occurring in Braxton, Lewis, and Harrison counties.
2. Ronnie Goines: Lead pastor of Koinonia Christian Church in Arlington, Texas, Goines was arrested in 2024 for allegedly sexually assaulting a female congregation member. Despite the charges, he returned to the pulpit and maintains his innocence.
3. Apollo Quiboloy: Founder of the Kingdom of Jesus Christ Church in the Philippines, Quiboloy has faced multiple allegations of sexual abuse and trafficking. In 2024, former church members testified against him, accusing him of grooming children for sex and other misconduct.
4. Edward-Richard Hinds: A Brooklyn pastor and leader of the 67th Precinct Clergy Council, Hinds was indicted in November 2024 on charges of sexually abusing a 16-year-old boy in December 2022. He faces multiple charges, including third-degree criminal sexual act and endangering the welfare of a child.
5. Todd Hubers van Assenraad: An East Geelong man linked to a controversial church, Hubers van Assenraad pleaded guilty in 2024 to multiple charges of persistent sexual abuse of children. The offenses involved nine boys under the age of 12 between 2016 and 2023.
a44f924e No.3763856
>>37638556. Mark Hatcher: Pastor of Holy Ghost Headquarters Revival Center in Philadelphia, Hatcher was convicted in 2024 of sexual assault of three minors, including a former congregant, in incidents dating back two decades.
7. Bruce Douglas Konold: A former, longtime Christian and Missionary Alliance pastor in Minnesota, Konold was convicted in September 2024 of criminal sexual conduct in the fourth degree (clergy) involving sexual misconduct.
8. Pierre Louis: A Florida pastor, previously convicted in a sex abuse case, was under investigation in 2023 after a 23-year-old church member accused him of sexual assault during a prayer session.
9. Daniel Kellan Mayfield: A former youth pastor at Gowensville Baptist Church in South Carolina, Mayfield was arrested in 2023 and faces nearly 150 charges related to voyeurism. He allegedly filmed individuals without their consent, with the number of charges increasing as more victims were identified.
10. Zachary King: A former pastor from Lexington, Kentucky, King was arrested in 2024 on charges of rape, sodomy, and sexual abuse involving a 15-year-old victim. The alleged crimes occurred between January 2023 and April 2024 at his home, the minor's home, and his former church.
cff0c877 No.3763916
>>3763855Everyone knows pedophiles exist dood. You're not breaking new ground.
