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File: my_skin_crawled.jpg - (90.17 KB, 1280x720) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
92330 No.3474559

Hillary Clinton's new book "What Happened" is now the No. 1 Best Seller on Amazon while Bernie Sanders' "Young Person's Guide to Political Revolution" is already floundering at #562 on the list. One of his reviewers said that's it nothing more than the ramblings and tweets of an old man with no instructions or any guidelines on a revolution.

https://www.amazon.com/What-Happened-Hillary-Rodham-Clinton/dp/1501175564

In this new bestseller she describes her experience dealing with Donald Trump, including how this sexual predator made "her skin crawl" and how he was a total "creep". I imagine you'd her the same sentiments from his third wife Melania as well.

No.3474560
File: Bush_is_now_more_popular_than_Bernie.png - (33.62 KB, 608x466) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
34432

She also exposes how the DNC and Obama forced her to "grit her teeth" when dealing Bernie and his misogynistic Bernie Bros™. Barack Obama apparently thought that if you showed Bernie respect and restrained Hillary from criticizing him personally, he'd graciously concede the primary as she had done with Obama. Oh how they were wrong. Now that Donald Trump has ended DACA, in an ironic twist of fate, George W. Bush is now more popular than Bernie Sanders.

No.3474561
File: bernie_demands_free_ponies.jpg - (160.38 KB, 900x1200) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
164232

In this excerpt, Hillary perfectly describes the exchange between a rational moderate and one of his Brocialists™.

Bernie: I think America should get a pony.

HILLARY: How will you pay for the pony? Where will the pony come from? How will you get Congress to agree to the pony?

Bernie: Hillary thinks America doesn't deserve a pony!
BernieBros: Hillary hates ponies!

HILLARY: Actually, I love ponies.

Bernouts: She changed her position on ponies! #WhichHillary? #WitchHillary

Headline: "Hillary Refuses to Give Every American a Pony"

Debate Moderator: Hillary, how do you feel when people say you lie about ponies?

No.3474562

sniff sniff

This smells like a 3B thread.

No.3474563

>>3474562

sniff sniff

This smells like a salty BernieBot or Trumpster.

No.3474567
File: bernie-sanders-loves-rape.jpg - (96.36 KB, 1608x905) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
98676

>>3474563

>a salty BernieBot or Trumpster.

lol, is there really a difference? Both of them literally make my skin crawl too.

No.3474569
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734727

>>3474561

No.3474570

What's funny is HRC vilifies Bernie in much the same way she and the media vilifies Trump. Blushingly accusing them of being responsible for the worst actions of any supporter.

Sorry HRC, Sorry big media, there are more Trumpers and more Bernouts then there are HRC supporters.

But you know what? I almost feel bad for her. She would have been better than Bernie because at least HRC and Trump both understand what it means to bargain from strength. Both understand that shit has to be paid for, somehow, too.

Christ, I can't believe I actually prefer HRC over Bernie. 2 years ago I would have called myself a fascist.

No.3474571

Just to further clarify my point, so it's not muddy...

Bernie is like the parent that lets you have everything, and expects nothing of you. You'll be super happy in the short term... But he'll get old and die. The pile of money he shares with you will become depleted... and then you'll become destitute. Incapable of caring for yourself, or others, to any degree.

HRC and Trump at least expect each individual to have some accountability and personal responsibility towards their financial situation, and that you have to eat your fucking vegetables instead of candy at every meal.

No.3474573

>>3474563
I ain't even American nigga.

No.3474575
File: Bernie-promises.png - (717.43 KB, 789x767) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
734650

>>3474570

>Sorry HRC, Sorry big media, there are more Trumpers and more Bernouts then there are HRC supporters.

Which is why she got millions of more votes than either Bernie in the primaries or Trump in the general, huh? That's why a few days ago her book was at #6 and his at #200, now she's at number #1 and Bernie's book is tanking faster than Trump's approval ratings?

No.3474579

>>3474575 The primaries are rigged, and of course, because he never went head to head with Trump the man became irrelevant again. I'm not just saying that, either. The lawsuit against the DNC was dismissed, but the brief that followed said that the DNC was entirely guilty of rigging it. Just that, private groups are allowed to rig their own shit because they're not actual government entities.

No.3474581
File: Hillary_votes.jpg - (39.42 KB, 540x540) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
40368

>>3474579
Okay, that bullshit excuse you desperately want to believe might explain why she got more votes in the primary, but if Bernie is so much more popular then why is is book doing so poorly? It's now at 829 as of this post.

And you didn't explain why she got millions of more votes than Trump in the general despite you saying "there are more Trumpers...then[sic] there are HRC supporters"? Now I understand that Trump won under the wacky rules of the Electoral College where the popular vote doesn't really matter, but you can't say there are more Trumpers when she got more votes. Only Obama got more votes than her in US history.

No.3474585

>>3474581 Her book sales don't translate to popularity for her. Much like the Dem primary, book best seller lists are rigged, mostly by sales to corporate think tanks which in turn inflate the sales. It's nothing new, conservatives do it all the time:
http://nomadicpolitics.blogspot.com/2014/11/cooking-books-how-conservative-best.html (Other sources are attributed there before you scoff like the idiot that you are)
Bernie's sales are actual genuine sales, unlike $hillary's.

Oh and how to prove that $hillary cheated? Actual video shows who was the more popular candidate https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=yJNDTAo1PkQ&t=98s She couldn't even fill a high school stadium! LOL!

Oh and a lawyer explaining in layman's terms how the Dems cheated Bernie: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=miDve_Ml1cI

Much like cuckservatives, Neo-liberal Wall Street cocksuckers are oblivious to facts.

No.3474587
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47333

>>3474585

>Bernie's sales are actual genuine sales, unlike $hillary's.

That's your belief. The link you posted suggests her numbers could be inflated (but you have no direct proof for her book specifically) and that doesn't explain why Bernie's book sales are so poor and continuing to plummet. Let me give you some time to scramble another conspiracy theory as to how the DNC is deflating his book sale numbers.

>Oh and a lawyer explaining in layman's terms how the Dems cheated Bernie
>reference is a failed TYT comedian

Okay, do you have any unbiased and reputable sources that doesn't involve this dipshit Bernie evangelist?

No.3474591
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883845

>>3474587

No.3474592
File: US_Population.jpg - (29.73 KB, 362x257) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
30444

>>3474581 The text on this graphic is dumb and misleading. "Over 63 million votes for President .. more than any white man in history". Who made this shit?

First of all - bragging about raw vote totals 'in history' is skewed by the US's ever-increasing population. It's like when Hollywood brags about a movie with "highest box office sales dollars in history" without considering ticket price inflation.

Second -- they had to awkwardly slip in the phrase 'white man' to fudge Obama out of their statistic.

No.3474598
File: Top_lel.jpg - (47.33 KB, 304x315) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
48469

>>3474581

>that pic

oh my fuck thats hilarious.

once again communists proving they're fucking retards.

No.3474599
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108496

>>3474567
This is a line taken from a paper about women's rights and how society projects unrealistic expectations on women. He was saying that men think women want to be forced to have sex because society tells men they fantasize about that kind of thing.

Cutting out that one small part of an anti-rape, pro-women paper and quoting it to make him look sexist just goes to show how desperate Clinton and her cult were to find ANYTHING to attack him with.

She did the same thing with Obama. Obama's supporters were all sexists, racists, "Obama Boys" because they dared to question her majesty's record.

Sexism is, and always was, her only card because her policy positions suck.

No.3474600
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106562

>>3474559

It's the best seller because it's on pre-order. Fun fact: One of the ways people donate to corrupt politicians in return for favors is buying lots of copies of their books and then just throwing them away once they are delivered. Like everything else in Clinton's life, her sales numbers are artificially inflated to make her feel better about herself because she's the one thing all people around the world hate most: A Narcissist.

No.3474601
File: hillary-clinton-super-projecting.png - (142.69 KB, 582x345) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
146117

>>3474581

>And you didn't explain why she got millions of more votes than Trump in the general...

Because the majority of Bernie voters who voted, voted for her. According to Pew Research about 20% of her vote was Bernie Voters biting the bullet and trying to stop Trump. When we said she stood no chance against Trump without us, we weren't kidding. Only 12% of us voted for Trump and those were, according to research, cross over republicans who had voted for Sanders in the primary but when the nomination was stolen went back to their own party.

Good policy has no party affiliation.

No.3474602
File: cognitive_dissonance.png - (90.50 KB, 426x213) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
92673

>>3474587

>do you have any unbiased and reputable sources...

What "unbiased and reputable source" would you find acceptable?
I've yet to see one of your cult members accept anything that doesn't conform to your cult's teachings.

No.3474608

>>3474581

How do I explain that? Illegal voting.

You take away California, one single state, and suddenly we see Trump won the popular vote AND the electoral college. You can giggle and snicker, call me paranoid, but a handful of states have been reviewed already and have found fraudulent voters in the hundreds of thousands range. They've also even put charges on a few people for voting multiple times.

If pussy-ass baby states are doing this, the grand mother of all socialism and illegals, commie-fornia, is certainly doing it too.

No.3474610

>>3474608
Nope. That's a bunch of fucking bullshit. There have been virtually no illegal votes cast, aside from fucking rightwingers trying to vote more than once in different districts.

No.3474611

>>3474610

It's not bullshit. The AP has verified some reports of this. How can you have counties with more votes cast than the number of registered voters for that county, for example?

Or are you accusing the AP, who greenlights negative anti-trump press on a daily basis, of being liars?

"Virtually" is a funny way of saying "there are some, but not enough for me to care."

Also, I'm completely correct in stating that if you remove California's impact on the popular vote, the popular vote goes to Trump.

I mean, do you not realize the popular vote was less than 1% difference between the two candidates?

And even so, we're ignoring the people who voted third party. If you add them to Trump's vote pool as people who voted "Not-Hillary" (which they most assuredly did) then she DEFINITELY lost the popular vote with all the Jill, Gary and Trump voters.

No.3474612

>>3474611

"Votes cast" don't mean shit. You're dealing with one of the largest countries on Earth, population-wise. There are going to be a lot of fucking people who vote when they aren't supposed to or in a way that they aren't supposed to, because people make mistakes. You're like those people who screech about "millions of dead people on the voter rolls". Yeah, no shit dumbass, people die between elections.

What matters is votes counted. If some greencard holder or illegal immigrant casts a vote, it doesn't fucking matter as long as they discard that vote like they're supposed to. Find me some proof that millions of votes are being counted illegally, dumbass. I'll wait.

No.3474613

PS: "Virtually" in this context means, "Single-digits, almost always fucking rightwingers who are obsessed with 'voter fraud' and decide to commit voter fraud to 'even the score'."

No.3474614
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297587

>>3474612
>>3474613

No.3474615

>>3474612

So what you basically just did is imply that with such a large population, a small number of bad votes don't have much meaning.

With the popular vote going to Hillary, at a fraction of a percent, that makes Hillary's popular vote also as meaningless as the illegal votes.

You can't have it both ways. Either fractions of a percent matter, or they don't. Bucko.

No.3474616

>>3474612

Funny that you want millions now. If you're so sure it's a small number, why demand proof of millions? I'd love to show you, but you got cucks like Chuck Schumer trying to block any deep examination of the voting system.

http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/chuck-schumer-asks-trump-to-disband-voter-fraud-commission-after-charlottesville-violence/article/2632491

Let's see though.

http://chicagocitywire.com/stories/511195461-election-board-lists-more-general-election-votes-than-voters-in-chicago

14,000 for one city is nothing though, right? It's not like there are hundreds of cities in the united states. It's not like you could easily have a third of cities doing numbers like this and end up with several hundred thousand, right? Funny, Chicago didn't even report needing to destroy 1,000 ballots. 14,000 more voters than there were supposed to be and less than 1,000 destroyed ballots. Hmmm. Guess they're NOT destroying these votes like they're meant to.

No.3474617

Of course, if what I have to say has no validity. What has California got to hide?

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/california-trump-voter-fraud-probe_us_5955683be4b0da2c7322389c?1dl

Ooooh shit son! There's fire to that smoke!

No.3474618
File: popular-vote.jpg - (171.42 KB, 1200x630) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
175533

>>3474592

>The text on this graphic is dumb and misleading. "Over 63 million votes for President .. more than any white man in history".

How is it misleading when it's true? The only other candidate to receive more votes was Obama who is a black man.

I posted that image in response to the claim that there are more bernouts and trumpsters. The numbers don't add up. You can say that Obama had more supporters, because that's true, but you can't say that about Donald Trump.

No.3474619
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321938

>>3474600

>her book sales are all a conspiracy!

yawn Somebody already beat you to that. And just like that previous poster, you forgot your conspiracy to explain why Bernie's book sales continue to plummet. Go ahead, I'll give you some time to pull something out of your ass.

No.3474623
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104877

>>3474602

>What "unbiased and reputable source" would you find acceptable?

How about anything involving actual journalists and not some former Republican, who's funded by Republicans, that plays pretend on YouTube.

http://www.politico.com/blogs/media/2014/04/buddy-roemer-firm-invests-4-million-in-young-turks-network-186934

Or how about somebody who doesn't get trolled by Alex Jones or crushed by Ben Shapiro in a debate?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4ZrEW13fwLc

The hacks at TYT are just that: hacks.

No.3474629

>>3474619

Actually, he's not wrong. Look at the now-canceled unstoppable wasp comic. Initial pre-orders were very promising. Was it actually popular? No. And that's why it's gone.

No.3474630

And I'd also say, Trump's art of the deal has been much more popular :3

Or all the other products people have bought just because the Trump name was on it.

Clinton is not a brand, Trump is.

No.3474637
File: smart stik.jpg - (28.27 KB, 400x300) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
28952
>"the president candidate of a country with 1000 people got 550 votes!"
>"thats more than all of the other previous presidents! back when the country's population was 900, 800, 600, 500, and less!"
>this is some sort of "achievement" or sign of victory to the retarded communist cult
>numbers are too hard! they must be a tool of nazi oppression!
No.3474650
File: computers_are_racist.png - (36.71 KB, 429x166) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
37596

>>3474637
Numbers are Nazis and computah is racis'

No.3474653

Bernie was in town last week giving a speech and selling his book as a 2 person pack in deal. The price was low enough to make me think he's really lost all of his steam for the time being. No one really cares right now, most people's are too busy frothing at the mouth over Trump and don't want to be reminded that he lost and they backed an even bigger loser in the general like cucks.

Bestsellers in terms of political books are meaningless engineered things since they count sales made to pacs and such who buy them specifically to give them away or resell without really caring if they get dumped later. The book isn't even out yet and yet the reek of AstroTurf that HRC's campaign is known for sticks to this book bad and can be smelled a mile away.

Begone, shill!

No.3474656

>>3474570

Agree, sounds like they are just trying to kill Bernie's political career once and for all. Because he is DANGER for cronnies and self established politicians like Hillary.

>>3474571

>HRC and Trump at least expect each individual to have some accountability and personal responsibility towards their financial situation

I haven't laughed this hard in a long time.

You mean as responsibly as bankrupting more than half the companies he made? Which a lot of them were just impulse buys and in some cases, were supposedly impossible to bankrupt and yet he did.. like the Trump casino debacle?
Trump got a golden ticket to riches by his parents.. and some very good lawyers.
He ain't financially responsibly AT ALL.
He is a perfect example of a spoiled rich manchildren.

No.3474658

>>3474581
You're mistaking popularity with unpopularity, and fame with infame.

Bernie was popular, but Hillary is popular and INFAMOUS.
Even her enemies or people who hate her would want to eat that shit.

>>3474592
This. They should be counting individual tickets sold.
Which have been actually decreasing thanks to high costs.

>>3474598

>communists...

You Keep Using That Word, I Do Not Think It Means What You Think It Means.

>>3474602
Agree, I've seen that shit everywhere about "reputable" sources.
Funny that these clowns would accept Alex Jones as their source of accepted information if it lined up with their cognitive dissonance.

>>3474611
So, are you saying that the entire California state is 100% illegal? and Therefore shouldnt be counted?
California has always been a hardcore Democratic (liberal) state.

That is like removing Texas or Arizona from the voting republican, because "its too full of rednecks".

>>3474616
It goes.. both.. ways..

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2016/aug/01/republicans-block-black-votes-fair-judges-crucial

https://www.theatlantic.com/politics/archive/2016/07/north-carolina-voting-rights-law/493649/

No.3474662

>>3474656

More thank half? You're using hyperbole.

No.3474666
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310989

>>3474650

No.3474685
File: tldr.jpg - (32.09 KB, 500x775) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
32856

All you need to know about that book is right there on the cover.

No.3474725
File: saltytears.jpg - (75.21 KB, 620x930) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
77018

>>3474653

Uh oh Nobu, looks like the green-eyed monster is out tonight. But I get it, she's going to only increase the vast Clinton millions with a new best-seller, going on to tour around the country and the late night talk show circuits are going to be fawning over her while lamenting the buyer's remorse with Trump. She's going to ascend to a new mythical status with Democrats while Bernie gets shuffled to the nursing home.

Also, just so ya know, Bernie ran out of steam way back during Super Tuesday. The fact that you morons wasted over $200 million to prop him so he could continue to fail in key states like Illinois, New York and California in some ironic Weekend at Bernie's amateur remake was just plain stupid on your part.

No.3474728
File: warned-ya.jpg - (57.05 KB, 1024x564) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
58419

>>3474658

>Bernie was popular, but Hillary is popular and INFAMOUS.

Not quite, Hillary is and always will be popular with Democrats. Bernie is popular with Independents. Unfortunately for bernouts, it's mostly Democrats who get to decide the Democratic nomination. This isn't hard to understand.

Bernie's team hoped they could turn the Democratic base against Hillary if the past two decades of Republican attacks were coming from an Independent instead. That's why he was doomed from the start.

No.3474731

Leftist thread #8702983765421
[-]

No.3474741

>>3474728

>Bernie's team hoped they could turn the Democratic base against Hillary if the past two decades of Republican attacks

Again... you mean how they sabotaged Bernie?
How the emails said clearly how they tried to block Bernie at all costs from getting elected?
lol.

No.3474752
>noboyuki

An open pedophile conservative, no surprise everything he posts is a shitpost of uneducated retardation. Go hook up with that Jin guy and molest some kids while thinking of how Milo endorses what you are doing, it's all you two are good for.

Nobo will eventually wander into a Chris Hansen sting and we won't have to deal with him anymore. Until he gets out on bail and screams "I WUZ FRAMED I DINDU NUFFIN!"

No.3474760
File: hillary-clinton-Correct_the_Record.png - (89.03 KB, 315x558) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
91162

>>3474619

Bernie's book sales are normal. Hers are over inflated because her millionaire friends are buying lots of copies to make her look more relevant than she actually is.

It's "Correct The Record" all over again. If the sales were honest sales she would do just about average if not worse but they are throwing huge sums of money at it to try and make her still look popular. It's what she has to do. She can't stand to look weak. It's a trait of narcissists.

No.3474761

Final word for you morons still shilling for $hillary:

“Democrats, and all voters, can take a look at the two different visions, ably articulated, by the two Democratic finalists.

“One person has been out in the country, almost without stopping, since the election rallying people to defend ObamaCare, against tax cuts for the wealthy and for a $15 minimum wage. The other person, while Drumpf has been ripping the country apart, has been taking long walks in the woods, drinking chardonnay, hobnobbing with celebrities and writing a book that entirely ignores the failure of the party establishment over a decade or two. People can choose which kind of party they prefer.” - Jonathan Tasini.

No.3474762
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117787

>>3474728

>it's mostly Democrats who get to decide the Democratic nomination. This isn't hard to understand.

The Democrats decide the nomination but independents decide the election we saw what happens when you choose party loyalty over picking the winning candidates.

No.3474775

>>3474725

I don't care about what Bernie does now, but you're deluded if you think any of this stuff H is doing is going to amount to anything, you muppet. Do you really think wall to wall bullshit is going to make everyone who "voted wrong" regret ever challenging the queen? Fat fucking chance my dude. They just turned off the TV after realizing how in the tank the media was for corporate Dems. She is still top AstroTurf and that ain't gonna change, and only an idiot would think running the same bullshit again is going to work for the Dems the next 2 cycles.

But that's why you're just a drone they hit up for cash and not an actual pol.

No.3474780
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24091

>>3474760

>Bernie's book sales are normal.

For the most popular Senator EVAR!!!! who would have easily crushed the Donald in the general, these abysmal numbers are "normal"?

>Hers are over inflated because CONSPIRACY!

Yes yes, I know. She became a Senator because nobody likes her. She technically got more votes than Obama in the primaries because nobody likes her. She got millions more votes than Bernie in the primaries because nobody likes her. She got millions more votes than Donald in the general because again, because nobody likes her at all. It's all just a big, manufactured conspiracy even though you have zero evidence to prove your case. Just the fact that you desperately want it to be true.

>>3474762
Yeah well, your guy never made it past the first round, it wasn't even close. Don't worry, you can use those same excuses of rigging and conspiracies when you fail again in 2020 and 2024 and 2028 and....

No.3474781
File: Cory_Booker_future.jpg - (52.09 KB, 999x999) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
53341

>>3474775

>you're deluded if you think any of this stuff H is doing is going to amount to anything, you muppet.

I didn't say it was going to change anything. I'm just doing it to rub your face in it because nobody gives a shit at all about that old kike you placed your hopes on to achieve your socialist dreams. Hillary is my bae and I'm glad to see her achieving a new status as a sort of tragic figure and folk hero status. I love watching Colbert or Kimmel make a joke about trading Trump in for the competent leadership of another Clinton in the White House. But no, she isn't going to run again.

As far as the future goes, all I can say is get to ready to address either Kamala Harris or Cory Booker as your president in 2020. We centrist, moderate Democrats already have a game plan we're setting into motion. Without Bernie, your cult is dead and all of this socialist nonsense won't be heard again for another couple decades or so.

You OWS/bernout faggots are just like gonorrhea, you'll flare up to embarrass yourselves and the entire left and then disappear for awhile once the damage is done.

No.3474782
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208547

Oh, and now Bernie is being sued for unpaid bills related to the 2016 primaries. Honestly, is anybody surprised with this deadbeat?

http://www.sandiegouniontribune.com/communities/south-county/sd-me-sanders-sued-0824-story.html

As shitty as Trump is, I think the nation is better with him in the White House than Bernie Sanders.

No.3474787

>>3474782

Fuck off, Hillarybot. It's assholes like you that helped Trump get into the White House.

No.3474789

>>3474787
You say that like it's a bad thing.

No.3474790

You know who else had Number 1 best seller? Milo Yinnopolas. And the red-pill documentary.

Almost like infamy is getting mistake for likability.

No.3474791

>>3474789
When Trump stops riding the last chugs of Obama's economic policies.. Well see.

No.3474793

>>3474782

Meanwhile..

https://www.forbes.com/sites/chasewithorn/2016/12/09/heres-how-much-trump-companies-were-paid-by-his-campaign-in-days-before-election/#53a4315a1727

You trumpists are so hilariously blind on convenience.

No.3474797
File: tumblr_oufjlm1TYt1tj2243o1_1280.jpg - (206.11 KB, 1280x737) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
211057

>>3474790

This is what I have been mentioning all along.

People confusing Infamy with popularity.

Hence why his book sales are that high. I bet even trumpists wanted to read the trainwreck of a book.

No.3474798
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76771

>>3474653

>Bernie was in town last week ... selling his book as a 2 person pack in deal. The price was low enough to make me think he's really lost all of his steam...

That's the difference between Sanders and Clinton. He wrote a book to spread his ideas and help the next generation become a force for change to help them have a better life.

Hillary wrote a book to whine and make money. Bernie's books have always been cheap because he wants people to have them. He sent a copy to every library in America who wanted it for free. He is trying to help. She is trying to make money.

No.3474799
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33669
No.3474801

>>3474791

LMFAO. WAIT. WAIT!

You're telling me, he can't plan to have a healthcare system that doesn't fall apart the very fucking year he gets out of office... BUT. BUT. He can plan an economic recovery that just so happens to get jumping and popping at the same time he leaves office?

You are THAT fucking retarded aren't you?

No.3474807
File: obabo.gif - (1513.59 KB, 400x317) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
1549921

>>3474781

>I didn't say it was going to change anything. I'm just doing it to rub your face in it
> We centrist, moderate Democrats already have a game plan we're setting into motion. Without Bernie, your cult is dead and all of this socialist nonsense won't be heard again for another couple decades or so.

You'd have a better chance squeezing blood from a stone. You don't know me, so get a life. I am anti-corporate, anti-technocrat, and a general shit-stirrer. Guys like you love to use the left and right to bounce off each other as they try to eke out little fiefdoms based on pointless shit like identity while believing yourself to be able to control 'em all like an elite.

You are basically middle-management, though. A brown-noser to the elites, but not actually one of them. You try to gain validation by shitposting on an imageboard because you know you're nothing in the world of politics.

Almost everyone has been over Bernie losing and have been since before Trump got elected. To be honest, Trump was the best thing to happen to guys like you, because he's basically the funhouse mirror version of the pigs you suck up to. We all get to have a laugh, and meanwhile you can keep pretending that you're the one safe and smug and above it all.

Remember though, you'll be shilling here forever. You can never leave.

No.3474825

>>3474801
Both Obama and Trump are such divisive presidents, and in reality so incapacitated by their personal qualities that it's rather what they don't do than what they do that makes everything happen.

The economy loves stability, businesses like it when things don't change so they can plan for the future. Obama being cockblocked by congress all the way is the main reason why anything went up during his reign, and Trump being sure to not do anything that would upset the wall street does the rest of the work.

No.3474837
File: hillaryclintonconfused1.png - (93.32 KB, 221x374) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
95560

>>3474825

You realize that when Wall Street profits from "Stability" it usually means that they are getting away with stealing money from you, right? Like, you are cheering on the people who are literally robbing you every day. They jack up inflation by creating imaginary profit without adding value and that makes the money you earn worth less and less and less. You are supporting your own destruction so that a room full of people can make more money to add to the mountains of money they already have.

No.3474840

>>3474837
Doesn't make a lick of difference. The economy goes up when the government is idle.

That's because business takes significant cost and effort to re-structure around new rules and regulations. Every time the government changes something, everybody has to scramble to adhere to the new situation and that's an economic disruption. When there's a threat that the government might do something, everyone's just holding their breath and not investing in anything or doing anything because it all might be foiled, but when the government is sure to not do anything for the next 4-8 years then you can do business.

Trump is just that sort of a break. Obama might have strong-armed some decision through, but Trump will not, and thanks to that, the economy is going up. And despite most of the spoils going to the top it's still better for the little guys as well - unlike with Obama when everyone were just waiting for the other shoe to drop.

No.3474841

Point being that during Obama, all the corporations were holding back their plans and holding back the money to safeguard against Obama's reactions to what they're doing with their money.

That meant an accumulation of business potential that was just waiting to break loose under Trump, so yes, you can thank Obama for the economic growth that Trump is experiencing - and you can thank Trump for enabling it all by being basically in the lap of big business.

No.3474847

>>3474837

>They jack up inflation by creating imaginary profit without adding value and that makes the money you earn worth less and less

Also, you're fucking clueless about economy.

Private profits that increase the income disparity lower prices because it draws money away from the general circulation. It's like Scrooge McDuck hoarding money in his vault - the more money the rich hold, the less money there is to go around, and the prices must go down to account for all the value being traded on the market.

What creates inflation is the government, by issuing ever more new bonds, which the FED buys to create more money. The government is doing this as a form of indirect taxation, since it cannot increase taxes to pay for all its commitments. This in turn appears to the man on the street as if the government is cheaper than it actually is, and leads to more debt-run social policies that increase the amount of money the government is committed to spend.

if the government didn't fund itself by debt, the man on the street would vote against it; in effect, people like Bernie Sanders would be instantly booed off the platform for being fiscally irresponsible.

No.3474850
File: C9-O01KWsAA_TeO.jpg - (87.76 KB, 492x873) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
89868

>>3474847

If someone announced that they found 100 tons of Gold, mined it and refined it without telling anyone, and are holding on to would that lower or increase the value of Gold on the market?

No.3474859

>>3474841
Point being that during Obama, all the corporations were holding back their plans and holding back the money to safeguard against Obama's reactions to what they're doing with their money.

Except you're forgetting that part of why Health insurers were abandoning the exchanges was due to Republicans pushing to completely undo Obamacare. Also, remember 2011 and the Government Shutdown, and every fight over the debt ceiling since?
https://www.theguardian.com/world/2013/sep/30/us-stock-markets-government-shutdown

Both instigated by the Republicans trying to get Obamacare abolished.

No.3474864
File: debt-limit-history-data-for-web-2013-updated-rjr-chart1 large.jpg - (246.11 KB, 1000x726) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
252021

Basically, how money creation works:

The government issues a bond, the FED buys it, and since a government bond is like gold in the bank they're allowed to issue new debt against it according to the rules of fractional banking. Something like, 1 dollar of federal IOU can generate 9 dollars of private debt.

The federal bonds mature over time, which means the government must tax the population and buy the bond back. When the bond is reclaimed, it stops existing and the private banks must close their loans based on that bond. In effect, when the government buys back its bond, it is destroying money. This is the mechanism by which the US federal government controls the amount of money on the market.

If private business comes up with bullshit non-value to catch some of the existing money, they lock up that amount and reduce prices for the real value that exists on the market because there exists less money to represent that part of the economy. You would see cheaper gas, cheaper food, cheaper housing etc. because some of the existing money is needed to run the stock exchange or things like that, and that would counteract the attempt because deflation slows the market down and makes the economy slower which would kill the profiteering capitalists.

Hence why, all the governments whether left or right, always issue more bonds than they buy back to keep the money supply growing faster than the growth of real value on the market, leading to perpetual inflation. The left uses the extra money to institute social policies they could not otherwise afford without causing a recession - essentially to buy votes without appearing to increase taxes - and the right uses it to pay back their corporate backers by creating the extra money to account for the bullshit business.

Both result in the indefinite growth of the state, to the point where the economy is run either by corrupt crony capitalists, or by corrupt bureaucrats, depending on which side you support.

No.3474865

>>3474859

>Except you're forgetting that part of why Health insurers were abandoning the exchanges was due to Republicans pushing to completely undo Obamacare.

Again, business was just holding back at the prospect of keeping to business as usual. What you're pointing at was exactly the resistance to change that I was pointing at.

No.3474869
File: US-Budget-Debt-1901-to-2021-e1459203158201-1200x629.jpg - (112.23 KB, 1200x629) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
114921

The irony is that the only time in history when the US federal government has not increased its debt was during...

drumroll
Bill Clinton's presidency. That's the only time the federal government actually shrank a little bit and didn't incur more debt and more inflation.

No.3474871

>>3474864

Wow, that is a long detailed answer to a question no one asked you. How about answering the question I did ask you.

If someone suddenly announces that they have secured 100 TONS of Gold and are holding on to it, would it lower or raise the value of Gold on the market?

No.3474879
File: get_your_fuckin_shine_box.png - (59.89 KB, 237x198) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
61328

>>3474807

>You don't know me, so get a life.

Haha, you're not that deep bro. I know enough. I know that at the time of the primary you were a jobless loser living at home, suckling on mommy's titty and whining about your broke-ass TV. Then you had to beg mommy for a ride to go vote for Bernie all so that Hillary could win Illinois. For fuck's sake, just a couple of weeks ago you were begging for a few shekels so you could get your rusty shitbucket over to Canada. Wow, what a baller! Don't pretend like there's much to know about you. This election, you were basically trying to slip your greasy hands into my pockets and I slapped the shit out of you.

>You are basically middle-management, though. A brown-noser to the elites, but not actually one of them.

You're right, I'm not one of the elites...yet.

>To be honest, Trump was the best thing to happen to guys like you

Yeah, I told you that. I wanted Hillary but my bank account wanted Trump, now I'm gonna spend the next few years amassing some fat stacks. My conscience is clear but I'll still profit insanely from the election results. I guess I have guys like you to thank for that. (´・ω・`)

No.3474881
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109594

>>3474837

>You realize that when Wall Street profits from "Stability" it usually means that they are getting away with stealing money from you, right?

If you have even a small amount of money on Wall Street right now, like myself, you're making money, not losing it. Trump's added over $2 trillion to the economy since he started. It's not that hard to get a piece of the pie if you, ya know, bothered to try.

No.3474883
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168967

>>3474840

>The economy goes up when the government is idle.

This man speaks the truth. I'd like to submit the oil & gas industry as an example. Right now with Trump in the White House, oil is more profitable at $50/barrel than it was at over $100/barrel under Obama.

http://oilprice.com/Energy/Crude-Oil/Goldman-50-Oil-More-Profitable-Than-100-Oil.html

Yes, you heard me correct. Even though oil lost half its value over the past couple of years, it's more profitable now than ever.

To be fair, part of that is the extreme cost-cutting measures across the entire industry, but the biggest reason is that government oversight is practically non-existent at this point. It's like a city that just fired its entire police force except one old man who was about to retire. I can attest to this from the inside. I can cut corners left and right to save a few bucks and there's nobody to do anything about it.

No.3474954

Donald Trump is working with Democrats in Congress to achieve comprehensive immigration reform in accordance with the Constitution and our legal code, unlike Obama. Republicans heads explode.

http://www.businessinsider.com/trump-daca-deal-democrats-2017-9

No.3474982

>>3474871

> How about answering the question I did ask you.

The only question you asked was whether I believe in your faulty understanding of reality, and I effectively said "no" - by explaining exacly why you have no understanding of what you're talking about, again.

>If someone suddenly announces that they have secured 100 TONS of Gold and are holding on to it, would it lower or raise the value of Gold on the market?

How did they secure it?

If the gold is bought off the market and vaulted away, it increases the price of gold by reducing the supply. Seen from the other side of the market, if gold is your money and gold is hoarded in a vault, all the prices drop.

Same thing happens with FIAT money. As money is locked away in the economic schemes of the rich, the prices must go down. This deflation causes a recession which would otherwise act as a damper on the economic scheming of the rich and steer the economy back to balance, but alas the government butts in and creates new money to keep inflation going because they think it's their job to "protect" the people from economic recessions - or because they know they're really printing the money for themselves - which then leads to what we're experiencing now: out of control spiralling government spending and massive wealth disparity.

No.3474984
File: DJP5KmtXUAAL9qZ.jpg - (158.57 KB, 850x1190) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
162373

>>3474982

>If the gold is bought off the market and vaulted away, it increases the price of gold by reducing the supply.

And here in is the problem with Trump-o-nomics. The market right now is creating massive wealth by rich people manipulating the stock market but nothing is actually adding value. It's just rich assholes trading sacks of money then claiming the sacks magically got more full then the Fed prints more cash to cover these imaginary growths.

Look at the art industry for example. There are a group of exclusive galleries who only trade to exclusive customers. One client buys a painting and because it was purchased by one of the art elite it becomes worth more. Then they sell it to another elite collector and that makes it worth more. Nothing has actually changed, it's just rich people saying that painting is growing in value because it's popular. They literally create money out of nothing just because all the people in that elite community agree it's now worth more money. It just keeps becoming more and more valuable the more it is traded. It's a common way to launder money. You can't export huge sums of money out of many countries without massive taxation but art isn't taxed the same so these arbitrary paintings become imaginary currency for the elite to dodge taxes.

It's a bubble and who ever owns the painting when the bubble pops is the sucker who gets ripped off. So they have to keep passing the painting around or risk being that sucker.

The stock market is a lot like that right now. No actual value is being added under Trump. It's just a big bubble of imaginary money with no value and when that bubble pops it will ruin the U.S. Dollar.

No.3474985

>>3474869

Dude. You've giving Billy boy all the credit for the .com boom.

Bill Clinton's economy had little to do with Bill Clinton. It had everything to do with the boom in silicon semi-conductors and internet service. This is like when we had our first self-made millionaires in the games industry and AOL was still hot shit.

No.3474987

I remember during the Obama presidency Trump and his supporters claimed the employment figures were fake and the stock market was being artificially inflated.

Funny how that talk all stopped suddenly, isn't it?

No.3474988

>>3474984
It's funny how you made a silent 180 turn on a dime to agree with everything I said, yet still try to pin the blame on Trump.

>The market right now is creating massive wealth by rich people manipulating the stock market but nothing is actually adding value.

That's what they've always been doing - and not only the rich but everybody who's trying to game the system. What do you think the whole "services economy" is? It's not just the stock market - 80% of the workforce is involved in some enterprise which mostly involves money changing hands and no new value being produce - like catering and retail. There's plenty of people who want to sell you something, and very few who want to make anything.

And it's all enabled by the fact that the government is pumping more money into the economy than is needed to represent the value in the economy. Some rich assholes trading paintings is penny poker compared to the trillions and trillions of dollars that the government is dumping out.

No.3474989

"It's like a city that just fired its entire police force except one old man who was about to retire."

That Trump supporters consider this a good thing speaks volumes about them, and none of it good.

I believe in the free market. But a free market without oversight isn't, ultimately, a free market: it's an unstable free-for-all.

No.3474990

>>3474987

It wasn't fake at all. I worked with a subway franchise owner as a book keeper. Our workers got re-classified from fast food to manufacturing.

We'd split full time jobs into 29 hour positions to avoid paying ACA benefits, so technically, we were employing twice as many people as before. ( At one point, we were even splitting management jobs into morning and night manager. )

If you don't see how actions like that can inflate the numbers of employed people, you're willfully refusing to see it.

No.3474992

But it all stopped the instant Trump was elected, right?

No.3474993

>>3474984

>They literally create money out of nothing just because all the people in that elite community agree it's now worth more money.

No. They're not creating money - only the government has the power to create money by issuing new bonds. They're capturing money with a bullshit reason: "This painting is valuable, so I should be getting more money for it."

Compare: "Flipping burgers and serving coffee is valuable, so I should be getting a higher minimum wage".

It's the same thing.

No.3474995

>>3474989

>But a free market without oversight isn't, ultimately, a free market: it's an unstable free-for-all.

If you don't let the market swing around as it may, you cause systemic problems to accumulate, which end up with even more horrible crashes. See for example the government "oversight" that set the goal of perpetual inflation to avoid the great recessions of the early 20th century.

Now we're heading for something much much worse with so much of the economy running on loony money and fake work.

No.3474996
File: 41GWQwvzJLL.jpg - (16.57 KB, 327x500) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
16970

>>3474990

>If you don't see how actions like that can inflate the numbers of employed people, you're willfully refusing to see it.

Incidentally, the left has been floating around the idea of a 4-hour work day as a solution to unemployment. The idea is that we should all be working less to fairly distribute the scarce commodity of employment in an increasingly automated world.

So there's nothing wrong with cutting your hours, right? It's just what the left would prefer to happen anyways, only, it should be done by the left instead of the right because the right solutions are the wrong solutions when the left isn't in control of it.

No.3475000

>>3474879

I'll take "shit you just made up" for $1000, Alex. I may not be loaded but that's fine. I'm not in denial about my current situation, unlike you, Mr. "Temporarily stuck here with the plebs". Don't ever bother trying to leave.

No.3475001

>>3474992

Actually, yes. We're letting people go above 29 in anticipation of ACA ending. We don't want to scramble to get full time workers when it makes business sense to do so. We're doing it now instead. The owner felt confident in doing this because Trump has already executive ordered off the individual mandate penalty.

We have two payroll people right now, we can downsize to 1 payroll person when all our staff is full time or above 30 part time. We'll also be opening up more locations and hiring more people in general because we wont be dodging the legal requirement to give healthcare based upon the total number of employees.

You really don't realize how many small businesses are skirting the law right now, do you?

You don't realize how many have stopped skirting the law with the fail of the ACA looming, under Trump, do you?

No.3475010

>>3474996 Czech republic has social comunisim sortof like a smaller democratic systen but controlled from the public which can suggest but not demand and they seem to be doing ok 3.9% unemployment getting better as an economy part of but seperate from EU Union.

No.3475036
File: hoobamon8-534990-Lingerie_D.va.jpg - (756.43 KB, 1048x1500) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
774581

>>3474988

>Some rich assholes trading paintings is penny poker compared to the trillions and trillions of dollars that the government is dumping out.

So you claim this is bad for the economy but billions of dollars being locked away in someone's vault isn't devaluing the rest of the dollars in the market? Which is it? Does money count all the time or not? Why do you think letting the wealthy amass more wealth than some nations could possibly be a healthy thing for the world's economy?

>>3474993

>They're not creating money - only the government has the power to create money...

LOL Yeah, no. Banks create money all the fucking time it's called Fractional Banking and the stock market is mostly IOUs and Promises that are totally meaningless.
https://youtu.be/pfXlA_zTfxY

Also, if I make a painting and announce it's worth $10,000 and someone is willing to buy that painting. Once it is sold, it becomes a form of money. I have my $10,000 and they have their painting worth $10,000 there is now an extra $10,000 in the economy because we made that transaction. You can make money out of nothing all day long, if you have money to pass back and forth.

No.3475038

>>3475036 cept your painting would depreciate in value by 90% you sold it as high but reality would put it at worth $1000 due to every other market factor.

No.3475044

>>3475038

The adults are talking. Go play Mighty Morphing Gynandromorph with your imaginary friends.

No.3475048

>>3475036

>So you claim this is bad for the economy but billions of dollars being locked away in someone's vault isn't devaluing the rest of the dollars in the market?

No you idiot... It's like you have the memory of a goldfish and the understanding of the same.

Someone locking away dollars is re-valuing the rest of the dollars. Under FIAT money even more so because the debt has to be paid back eventually and the debtee has to gain the money back at any cost, so if people are holding on to dollars then prices drop.

No.3475049

>>3475036

>LOL Yeah, no. Banks create money all the fucking time it's called Fractional Banking

Again, you fucking moron - the banks can only generate that money against their holdings of government bonds, which serve as the reserve currency. No government bonds, no new money.

The government creates the money by creating the bonds - the banks cannot do that on their own.

No.3475051
File: s2anp.jpg - (41.45 KB, 320x378) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
42446

>>3474883

>Right now with Trump in the White House, oil is more profitable at $50/barrel than it was at over $100/barrel under Obama
>It's like a city that just fired its entire police force except one old man who was about to retire. I can attest to this from the inside. I can cut corners left and right to save a few bucks and there's nobody to do anything about it.
No.3475054
File: Fractional_reserve_lending_varyingrates_100base.jpg - (56.24 KB, 623x365) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
57593

>>3475049

The fractional reserve banking system acts as a money multiplier, so for whatever amount of money the government creates directly, the banking system multiplies through private lending.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Money_multiplier

>in a fractional-reserve banking system, the total amount of loans that commercial banks are allowed to extend (the commercial bank money that they can legally create) is equal to an amount which is a multiple of the amount of reserves.

That's also accounting for the money that individual people deposit back in the banks, which can be used as further reserve. The banks cannot cross-lend to generate more reserves.

No.3475063
File: Gasoline_Trickle_Down_Economics.png - (198.99 KB, 350x402) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
203766

>>3475054

Oh, I see what you are saying, your argument isn't "Rich people are not over inflating their own wealth and there by making poor people's money worth less and less." it's "Rich people can only MOSTLY destroy the value of the dollar but not completely so that makes it ok."

No.3475071

>>3475063
Now you're just babbling incoherently.

I'm saying that without the help of the government to create new money, the rich people could only create deflation by demanding fantastical prices for worthless luxury items. Deflation would kill their own businesses.

And holdings of luxury items is incredibly tiny compared to the economy anyways. There's just so much to go around, and they depreciate in value pretty quickly. The market for luxury items is more of a means to extract money out of the upper middle class - as something like a premium sports car is really a consumable item that loses 99% of its value just sitting around.

No.3475072

>>3475063
The thing you don't seem to understand is that the luxury item is a hot potato game. It passes from person to person at ever-increasing prices until at some point it gains such a high valuation that nobody will buy it anymore. The final person to hold it essentially loses their money - because the item held no real value to begin with.

It's like the tulip mania. The trade of imaginary value draws money and locks it away from the rest of the economy, which causes deflation. When people are gambling and playing poker, the money they put on the table is unavailable for the rest of the economy to use. As the poker game continues on and the amount of money on the table grows and grows, prices elsewhere drop and drop, and that hurts the ability of the players to raise more money to continue the game because any real value they're selling gains them less and less - unless they can somehow print more money to replace the amount they're pulling out of the economy for their games.

And that's where the government comes in.

No.3475076
File: 71VGJQFZ6HL._SL500_AC_SS350_.gif - (20.41 KB, 350x350) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
20897

>>3475072
this reminds me of the "ULTRA HIGH VALUE" beanie baby phenominon of the 90's.

Its actually exactly that pehnominon, and would be more clear to the average 90's "millinial" to think of than curency itself. Just think of dollars as beanie babies, and suddenly economics makes sense.

No.3475081
File: rex-tillerson-exxonmobil-ceo.jpg - (222.56 KB, 2000x1125) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
227898

>>3475000

>I'll take "shit you just made up" for $1000, Alex

Yep, I totally made up that you were begging for people to help you get your rusty shit-bucket fueled for your "international" vacation to Canada. Even though your post is still available here: >>3471297

>Need more shekels so I can put gas in my shit car and make it to canada for nice vacation~

What's next on your list for a vacation? Detroit? Toledo? Just for your frame of reference, I'm planning a 3 week vacation through southeast Asia (Thailand, Cambodia, and Vietnam) but I'm sure Canada is nice too. (´・ω・`)

Oh, and just so you know, you dancing for pennies to put gas in your car only helps my industry and makes it that much richer. So thank you for helping me get that much closer to achieving my dreams of joining the elite of this country with your begging. (´・ω・`)

No.3475082
File: Bernie-Or-Bust.jpg - (324.29 KB, 1160x628) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
332078

>>3474989

>That Trump supporters consider this a good thing speaks volumes about them, and none of it good.

You're ignoring the fact that many Bernie supporters made this happen so that we'd be "woke", whatever the fuck that mean. You can't blame Republicans entirely for the current situation. You wanted "Bernie or Bust", well here's your bust.

Corporate America is going to consume countless billions with this presidency and if you're like me, somebody with skills useful to corporate America and investments, etc. you're going to make at least some money. If you're a broke-ass faggpt with no marketable skills, then yeah, you're fucked.

No.3475083
File: Stop_The_Bullshit_by_AmateurExpert92.jpg - (494.50 KB, 900x1165) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
506364

>>3475081
Are you the trollfag here that hints at having staggering amounts of wealth, power and prestige? Yet you spend your time shitposting on one of the most backwater, inconsequential sites on the Internet?

Yeah, lemme introduce you to this guy, Insane Kangaroo. You two should get along great, mebbe even date each other.

No.3475084

>>3474581
because his book is fucking boring.

No.3475085

>>3474612

>> as long as they discard that vote

You realize that votes are anonymous - you don't know who votes whom, unless they are willing to tell? The very foundation of democracy, once you're allowed to cast the vote, the link between your name and your vote is severed.

There's no way to discard a vote of a specific voter after it's been cast.

No.3475087
File: engineer_life.jpg - (37.07 KB, 447x438) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
37956

>>3475083

>Are you the trollfag here that hints at having staggering amounts of wealth, power and prestige?

Uh, no? I'm the young, almost 30-year-old Hispanic male who busted his ass to get scholarships, working full-time so that I had little student debt so that I paid it off in about 2 years once I stated with an $80k/year salary in the Oil & Gas industry here in Houston, Texas since I have 2 Master's Degrees in STEM fields. Don't worry about me and Hurricane Harvey. I live in an affluent area not directly affected by the flooding.

I am the sole Hillary Clinton supporter battling against bernouts like Nobuyuki, GoogleFuFaggot, ClockWorkRingtail, 43B, Sorrowful and about 90% of this board that supported Bernie Sanders because they stood to gain from his "free" proposals.

Naturally, I succeeded as Bernie never even came close to earning the Dem nomination. I supported Hillary Clinton through the primaries and into the general, but as an Oil & Gas engineer in Texas, my personal finances only stand to benefit with Trump in the White House. But now that he's in there (against my wishes) I stand to benefit. You'll have to ask Sorrowful, GFF, 3B, Nobu, etc. what gained with a Trump victory. I'm guessing nothing.

No.3475088
File: main-qimg-d994f33965aba42b7537b7d36380c083-c.jpg - (32.07 KB, 480x489) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
32842

>>3475087
Now granted I started at $80k/year some 4 years ago so now I'm solidly in the 6-figure range. I guess that means I have "staggering amounts of wealth, power and prestige" compared to BernieBros like 43B, Nobu, GFF, Sorrowful, etc. but I think that just reflects on how little they have more than how much I have.

No.3475089
File: bWAAM498U.jpg - (15.93 KB, 236x236) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
16314

>>3475088
And again, I also have to add that Texas has no state and local taxes and the second cheapest property values in the nation. Which means that my money goes much further than Nobu's in Chicago, Sorrowful's in Wisconsin, GFF's in New York (outside NYC) and probably even 43B even though I don't know where exactly he lives. But unless he lives in Oklahoma, he pays more than me for housing.

No.3475090

>>3475088

The only other persons I ever see posting motivational meme pics here are Aufy and 3B. Been browsing for years.

Definitely something to think about....I mean, can you imagine if they were actually so crazy as to create fake forum personas to empower the type of divisive topics they thrive on? I will say that you're post doesn't read like an Aufy post...but I wonder...

Just a thought, anyways ;3. Continue your "debate".

No.3475092
File: 10252016_ranking_3-edit_1833x917_copy_2_0.png - (2035.95 KB, 1660x895) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
2084808

>>3475090
Well, again, ask the major bernouts on this board. I haven't hid my credentials, I haven't shied from the fact that I work in the subsea oil & industry here in Houston, Texas.

The last major technical debate I had with bernouts was with that dipshit GoogleFuFaggot who claimed that if you worked on designing and manufacturing tanks and their associated components, you were unemployable. I can find dozens of uses for those people with that experience, especially since tank barrels, gun barrels and wellheads all fall under the same ASME Boiler and Pressure Vessel Codes VIII Divisions 2 and 3. GFF wanted you to believe that if you worked on tanks your whole life, you could only find work in McDonald's and I schooled his ass, demonstrating that those workers could easily find employment in my industry.

But you continue to believe that Bernie is your savior, it's worked so well so far. (´・ω・`)

No.3475100
File: Bullshit_Study_detected.png - (97.30 KB, 574x858) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
99632

>>3474560

The reason this guy was pointing this study out is because it seemed like so much bullshit. It is if you read it.

No.3475101
File: testicle statistic.png - (6.64 KB, 225x225) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
6797

>>3474618 The vote total numbers might be true but I'm saying this is a misleading statistic. One reason there are more VOTES is because there are more PEOPLE to vote .. and if you're taking away Obama then you're comparing vote totals in 2016 (US Pop 323.13M) to vote totals in 2004 and prior (US Pop 292.81M and less)

A similar misleading statistic is like saying the average salary now is $45000/year but in 1980 it was $15000/year therefore AMERICANS MAKE THREE TIMES MORE now vs than in 1980. ♦

While correct in a literal sense it is misleading because that also implies people now can buy 3x more stuff than in 1980. They can't -- because prices have increased by nearly the same amount since 1980. That's why you'd want to use 'adjusted dollars' to make a fair comparison.

In the voting example you'd be better off using 'votes per capita' but if you did you'd probably find other presidents with a greater 'votes per capita'. -- An even better value would be 'votes per number of eligible voters') -- Maybe she'd still lead, maybe not.. you'd have to run the numbers. My guess is no, otherwise they wouldn't have used such a sloppy statistic.

♦ PS - my salary numbers are made up for this example but they should be pretty close.

No.3475109

>>3475089

>Everything is great! The oil industry is booming! I'm just fine!

Says the guy who learned nothing from Venezuela and the complete collapse of their economy because they depended too much on oil...

No.3475112
>people still think Bernie had a chance when he said he was going to raise taxes on rich people and feed poor people with the money

It's like talking to a brick wall. No sorry but Trump "won" because the establishment wanted one of their own to protect them. Fair election? Yeah right. Russia helped because they know Trump would make them money and because Hillary wouldn't tolerate Putin being a murderous fascist asshole. If it wasn't for their nukes, a sane president would have dealt with him long ago.

Kind of amazing how Putin has Jewish lineage and has outlawed Holocaust denial, yet he otherwise acts like Hitler. He treats gays the way Hitler treated Jews, he controls his media, he's taken to anti-piracy as a further means to bully the people he controls, and his nation is still a corrupt shithole where only a small few have most of the money or resources.

And Trumpets actually want Putin's ways to happen in this country. They all know their rich Jew Yorker is Putin's lapdog and they like it.

No.3475114

>>3475109
I got a good chuckle from this post. 3B is so fucking retarded it's funny.

No.3475115

>>3475112
Trump is jewish and he's hitler. We're a puppet government for Russia which is a jewish state under the rule of Putin who is a jew but also he's like hitler. This nigga trippin.

No.3475123
File: la noir doubt.gif - (92.10 KB, 300x200) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
94309

>>3475108 Doubt button (×) -- if your state follows any kind of voting privacy laws your name shouldn't be attached to any specific votes at any level.

I HAVE however seen web sites that lists which elections you've voted in. That information IS public.

No.3475128

I think the real fact is that when it comes to who is Coocamunga its definitely a crazy white bitch as president.

No.3475151

>>3475128

I have to agree that Trump is indeed a crazy white bitch, as president.

Unless you meant to say that Trump is a crazy white bitch-ass president. To which I would also agree.

No.3475170

>>3475081

The trip part was self-evident, you made up the rest as nearly complete fiction and hyperbole because it's the only way you feel like you can completely dismiss this stick in your craw. It's a disingenuous tactic and you outed yourself by focusing on the part that wasn't ever in dispute. You should know better.

This is the same crap you tried to pull when I used the phrase "killed my TV" to describe turning off the mainstream cable news and finally cancelling my cable subscription entirely during 2016. Give me a break. I hope you don't try passing these kinds of lies out on your technical tasks. Your career as an engineer would be as dead as your political one.

Also, I drove through Detroit on my trip and it wasn't half bad. Makes me sad to think about their decline tbh. And I used to live near Toledo. Why you'd mention that city considering its size I wouldn't know but maybe it was some kind of Freudian slip since their primary industry used to be.... What exactly? Or maybe you knew someone else from there?

No.3475172

>>3475151

But I thought Obama was the crazy white bitch president?

He certainly did have his emotional melt downs when he didn't get his way.

No.3475192
File: Missing-the-Point.png - (16.67 KB, 203x204) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
17075

>>3475101

>One reason there are more VOTES is because there are more PEOPLE to vote .. and if you're taking away Obama then you're comparing vote totals in 2016 (US Pop 323.13M) to vote totals in 2004 and prior (US Pop 292.81M and less)

That's only true in the general sense, otherwise the record would be broken with every election. But the reigning Champ is still 2008 Obama by millions almost a decade later.

Also, you're missing the point that in the last 3 elections that haven't been between some white guy and another white guy, the white guy doesn't get the votes. Now I know that Donald Trump is president thanks to the wackiness of the Electoral College, but my queen got the popular votes. You should take heed of that trend if your plan continues to involve supporting the old white man in our primaries because that's not gonna go well for you.

No.3475194
File: bernie-venezuela.jpg - (73.37 KB, 736x588) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
75135

>>3475109

>Says the guy who learned nothing from Venezuela and the complete collapse of their economy because they depended too much on oil...

But we did learn from their mistake. That's why that old socialist fossil didn't even come close to getting the nomination despite him outspending Hillary and the Republicans by millions of dollars. We didn't want to have Bernie bring that crap over here.

No.3475195
File: Sanders_Slander.png - (120.33 KB, 292x518) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
123222

>>3475192

>She got the popular vote...

Pew research data shows 20% of that was Bernie voters. How do you think that will out for the next Democrat after Clinton throws her book-tour tantrum?

No.3475196
File: venezuela-oil.png - (790.85 KB, 1307x653) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
809831

>>3475194

>Poorly researched argument #213.

I have a meme for that.

No.3475197
File: Correct_The_Record_Primary.png - (93.09 KB, 279x471) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
95326

>>3475194

>Poorly researched argument #124

I have a meme for that too.

No.3475198
File: 0039587cf536f293770547c5af076afc.jpg - (85.64 KB, 564x564) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
87692

>>3475170
Look, I'm just going by what you said at the time. During the primaries you said you had no job, you had no car and expressed interest in an electric car, you said that mommy and her friend gave you a ride to go vote. You even took pride that you convinced them to vote for Bernie even though Hillary still won Illinois.

But we're splitting hairs here, the point isn't how much of a broke faggot you are, it's that you are a broke faggot. You're a loser with no money, ergo you voted for Bernie Sanders. GFF is a virgin in his 30's with no money, ergo he supported Bernie (but didn't vote because he's useless). 3B is an autistic retard with no money, ergo he voted for Bernie Sanders. You seeing the trend here?

Now compare that with me, a guy with 2 master's degrees in engineering and a 6-figure salary and I voted for Hillary Clinton.

Also, I just picked Detroit and a random city in Ohio. I could've gone with Dayton, Akron, Cinncinnati, Cleveland, it doesn't matter because it's all still Ohio and it would make for a really shitty vacation.

No.3475201
File: saudi_oil.jpg - (168.83 KB, 1200x675) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
172880

>>3475196
Haha, oh wow. First of all, you completely disregarded US shale, which is the biggest contributor to the collapse of oil prices. As long as the US keeps fracking (and it definitely will with Donald Trump in the White House), the price of oil will never reach $100/barrel again anytime soon.

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/business/2017/06/07/oil-prices-collapse-us-shale-hits-back/

Also, your meme still acknowledges that Hugo Chavez was a stupid asshole who never understood economics or how to invest properly. Saudi Arabia is just as dependent on oil but they started investing in alternative energy to power their own country and saved up a hefty rainy day fund just for this sort of situation. It's kinda sad when a theocratic monarchy is a much better system than a socialist republic.

No.3475203

>>3475201

Like most politicians. We should really start electing only people who have actually gone to school to do the thing they are elected for.

No.3475208
File: 1438881685231.jpg - (24.58 KB, 800x536) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
25175

>>3475196

>blaming capitalism for venezuela's collapse

Just like the USSR, right?

No.3475214

>>3475198 Yeah I see a pattern- Hillary- rich sociopath with zero regards for fellow beings. George Clooney- rich asshole who voted for $hillary, Al Franken- rich asshole who supported $hillary. and you, rich asshole who supports $hillary. Intelligence has nothing to do with it. You clearly are an uniformed idio with no regard for the majority of your fellow beings trying to make it through the day.

So from all of us to you- FUCK YOU, you worthless scum. Try being a teacher in public education and see if you can figure out how to be an actual empathic human being you scum.

No.3475219
File: pedophilia.jpg - (69.41 KB, 750x634) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
71074

>>3475214

Oy vey, don't you know celebrities endorsed Hillary? How could you be against her? Just watch this video where rich assholes yell at the middle class to vote for someone who bails bankers, promotes globalization, and supports the military industrial complex!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nRp1CK_X_Yw

No.3475221

>>3475198

>During the primaries you said you had no job, you had no car and expressed interest in an electric car, you said that mommy and her friend gave you a ride to go vote. You even took pride that you convinced them to vote for Bernie even though Hillary still won Illinois.

I didn't say any of this stuff. I've had the same car forever, I've had a job but just got a better one in January (even though I'm still underemployed), and my polling place is right by my apartment. My parents aren't even in the same voting district. You're either a liar or your creative memory makes a liar out of you. Either way, it's the sign of a sociopath. Just quit bothering to try to bullshit people, you're not going to win anyone over lying through your teeth like that.

No.3475222
File: Ask_Yourself.png - (134.19 KB, 558x1121) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
137407

>>3475221

A Hillary Clinton supporter who is delusional and edits history to force reality to conform to their pre-existing beliefs? Naaaah. That can't be true.

No.3475224

>>3475196

>Venezuela implements socialism and the economy collapses
>it had nothing to do with socialism and everything to do with the flaws of capitalism

What, just what?

No.3475226
File: 1302046784.wolfy-nail_junk_artist_05.jpg - (237.24 KB, 1050x844) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
242934

>>3475224

The simple version is that their economy was based almost completely on oil exports. The price of oil was high and they believed that they had a stranglehold on the market so they could spend and barrow like they would never run out of money. Then the oil market collapsed and they ran out of money. The socialist programs had nothing to do with the collapse. Venezuela failed for the same reason the south collapsed before the civil war. They put all of their economic eggs in one basket then when the bottom fell out of the basket they were fucked.

No.3475228

>>3475226
But if they didn't have those socialist policies then wouldn't they have been able to invest to expand other industries? Somebody already mentioned Saudi Arabia which is also really dependent on oil exports, but they seem to be doing fine.

No.3475229

>>3475228

Saudi Arabia is not socialist.

No.3475233

>>3475226 niggers everywhere mang.

No.3475239
File: Dance-Monkey.gif - (554.04 KB, 200x200) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
567335

>>3475214

>waaah! you have money and I don't so that makes you evil-waahh!

Look loser, you tried to get that old kike to redistribute my wealth into your pockets, but like so many things in your life you failed at that too. If you want my money that badly, I'm down to let you dress in a chimp suit and you can dance for my amusement as I throw nickels at you. How does that sound?

No.3475240
File: look-son-poor-people.jpg - (98.50 KB, 400x400) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
100864

>>3475221
You're just denying it to make it seem like you're slightly less of a pathetic poor faggot than you are. If I didn't have access to that post still in the stickied thread, you'd be denying that you ever begged people to buy your art so you could afford gas. But like I said, it doesn't matter how much exactly of a stupid poor faggot you are, just that you are one. So I'll give it to you, let me just get up on my podium to issue a formal redaction.

Everyone, if I can have your attention please! I mistakenly said that Nobuyuki had lost his job and was unemployed during the time of the Democratic primaries last year. That is not true. Nobu has been able to maintain steady, shitty part-time employment and was not actually jobless. Thank you for your time.

There, are you happy now? Also if you ever need to some extra cash for your next vacation, I'll extend you the same offer I made previously to the other poster and you too can dance for nickels for my amusement.

No.3475244
File: Venezuela-750.jpg - (177.66 KB, 750x908) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
181921

>>3475228

>Somebody already mentioned Saudi Arabia which is also really dependent on oil exports, but they seem to be doing fine.

That's because Saudi Arabia may be run by religious extremists who reject science, but they are nowhere near as stupid as socialists. The Saudis invested billions overseas and now have an enormous wealth fund that's allowed the nation to weather the current downturn even though they are dependent on oil exports.

>>3475226

>their economy was based almost completely on oil exports

Which is the fault of the economically-ignorant socialists running Venezuela.

>they believed that they had a stranglehold on the market so they could spend and borrow like they would never run out of money

Again, the fault of the dumbass socialists running the country.

>Then the oil market collapsed and they ran out of money.

Yet again, this was because the socialists were too stupid to save or invest any of their oil profits.

No.3475247
File: 0fa27f4e9f24a58f29cdcdcdd92a2072f706c492.png - (657.79 KB, 666x912) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
673580

>>3475228

>But if they didn't have those socialist policies then wouldn't they have been able to invest to expand other industries?

I'll try and over simplify it for you because it is difficult to understand how they could fail so hard so fast.

Nothing stopped them from divesting even with the socialist policies. They just choose not to because they had one of, if not the largest supply of oil on earth. They thought it was a money train that would never end.

The problem was that unlike the other OPEC nations their oil was a thick crude that was costly to produce. When it's selling at $100 per unit, it doesn't matter if it costs $38 per unit to produce, you still make good money off of it. That price dropped to less than $50 per unit very quickly so they went from making $62 a barrel profit to $12 that's 80% less per unit.

No country, capitalist or otherwise, can survive an 75%+ drop in it's main source of GDP within three years. The other nations were not hit so hard because their oil wasn't so expensive to refine. Even with all the other industries they have they are struggling at 30% lower over all GPD since 2013.

In addition to that shit show they are also suffering from one of the worst droughts in the history of their nation. So bad that the lakes and rivers have dried up to the point that the hydro-electric damns can't even produce electricity well. They are dependent on outside resources while their money becomes less and less valuable every day.

Many experts believe this nation was the victim of larger global politics where America and Saudi Arabia want to stop Russia from gaining a larger market share on oil. Getting to act like socialism is to blame for the collapse of one of the best capitalist success stories in the world was just an added bonus.

http://oilprice.com/Energy/Oil-Prices/Did-The-Saudis-And-The-US-Collude-In-Dropping-Oil-Prices.html

No.3475248
File: CchA6VNWIAAaTA3.jpg - (68.76 KB, 600x600) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
70411

>>3475239

>Look loser, you tried to get that old kike to redistribute my wealth into your pockets...

Here we have the truth revealed. He's afraid the Jews are coming for his money. Stay classy.

No.3475249
File: LcVZZzIZ.jpg - (32.03 KB, 400x400) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
32796

>>3475244

No one is arguing that their leadership weren't total dumbasses but it had nothing to do with socialism and everything to do with arrogance. The same arrogance that makes you believe your oil job is safe even though America has been hit by 4 major storm events in 3 weeks. I'm sure that and the advances in alternative energy aren't at all going to hurt the American oil industry, right?

http://oilprice.com/Alternative-Energy/Solar-Energy/New-Solar-Tech-Produces-50-More-Energy-Than-Silicon-Cells.html

No.3475260

>>3475240
I know you're just a trollfag whose connection to the energy industry is you work the night shift at a ghetto gas station; but I want you to know I'm really enjoying your story posts. You are certainly putting your insecurities and triggers to creative use!

No.3475261
File: Hallafuckingluya.png - (212.00 KB, 288x401) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
217083

DING DONG THE BITCH IS DEAD!

Obama and the DNC have told Clinton to cut that shit out. She will not be poisoning the primary in 2020.

No.3475264

>>3475240

You're an ass, but I accept your shitty 'apology' nonetheless. It's the least I can do for the morally bankrupt.

No.3475271

>>3475249

>No one is arguing that their leadership weren't total dumbasses but it had nothing to do with socialism

It has everything to do with socialism, because socialism breeds bad leadership.

It's a system that is basically built for the concentration of power from the economy at large to a small political class. The problem is that while power is concentrated, the information about what to do with the power is not, and the state would have to spend considerable effort to gain knowledge about what's really going on in the economy and what the real effects of their actions are. The Soviets tried to, and found out they were always running behind, and they found out they were being systematically lied to anyways as nobody made honest reports.

As the leadership never admits fault they can't even attempt to fix the situation. The state inevitably turns incompetent at running the country, and you can't remove them from power because the ruling elite is protecting themselves by violence if necessary. This is why every single socialist state in the world has turned into a shithole, time and time again.

No.3475272

Socialism is fundamentally the argument that the people in the society have a problem - that they themselves cannot see except for a handful of enlightened individuals - so it is the task of these individuals to make everyone else understand that they have this problem, and then deal with the problem by placing these few enlightened individuals in charge of solving it.

If you're smart, you can immediately see why this system goes wrong. The hint is in the question: if you can't percieve a problem without being told that it's a problem, is it really a problem?

Hence why, the socialist invents trouble and re-defines issues such that they now need fixing, and the more problems they find the more power they gain over other people - so naturally the enlightened elite attracts those who want power instead of solving real problems. The naive leftist thinks they're being kind and helping other people - while the intelligent leftist knows they're doing it simply for themselves.

No.3475275
File: caiso-duck-curve-1024x716.jpg - (107.57 KB, 1024x716) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
110147

>>3475249

>I'm sure that and the advances in alternative energy aren't at all going to hurt the American oil industry, right?

On the contrary, the more the states subsidize solar and wind energy, the more unstable their grids become and the more they also need expensive load balancing power which comes from oil and gas. Companies are now making a killing selling huge marine diesel engines for stationary peaking reserves, because other types of powerplants can't respond fast enough to the load variations caused by renewables.

Couldn't be happier times for the oil and gas industry.

No.3475276
File: Energy-Consumption-Reference-Case-20170105.png - (81.17 KB, 684x364) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
83120

Also, since the force-feeding of renewable energy into the grids causes load balancing and transmission issue, it also causes electricity prices to go up across the board.

Which causes the industry and homes to switch increasingly to natural gas.

No.3475278
File: 1438620677413.png - (282.63 KB, 2000x1200) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
289413

>>3475271

Penn Jillette gives a pretty simple and understandable reason why he can't put up with socialist policies, "If you wouldn't punish someone who's done nothing wrong, why would you reward someone who's done nothing right? You can't reward without punishing."

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OG3Kyk3Xc5A&t=2m59s

No.3475280
File: ihappened.jpg - (78.66 KB, 634x695) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
80546
No.3475281
File: fallout_4_e3_2015_concept_art_1.jpg - (292.98 KB, 2700x1442) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
300010

>>3475271

>It's a system that is basically built for the concentration of power from the economy at large to a small political class.

No, that's capitalism. If you don't believe me look at the wealth gap in America. The very basic idea of socialism is keeping the profit from the workers in the hands of the workers. That's why your kind of ignorant calls it "Wealth redistribution" because it PREVENTS the money and power from being in the hands of a only a few people.

Let me try and explain this to you in parable so you can see past your anger and bias.

Lets say you, as a parent of two, have a great job selling wooden lawn furniture. You found a niche market with few people competing in it because making hand crafted lawn furniture is labor intensive and needs a hard to get kind of wood. Your good because you are sure you have a stranglehold on the market and everyone wants your furniture.

Because you have so much money you buy yourself a new truck for delivery and new tools to make furniture faster, you donate to the local homeless shelter and make sure the school can provide food for all the kids in pre-school. You have everything you could ever want.

Then Walmart starts mass producing furniture exactly like the stuff you sell only at half the price and suddenly no one is buying your stuff any more. Your car payments and mortgage go into default, your have to stop feeding the local kids, you can barely afford to feed your own kids. You try and find other work but Walmart undercuts you at every opertunity until you are in financial ruin.

Is the reason your business failed because you helped hungry children or because Walmart fucked over your local community?

If you had refused helped hungry children would it have stopped Walmart from coming in and fucking over your business? No? Then the failing of your business was from the inherent flaws of capitalism not because you support socialist programs.

No.3475282
File: Fallout4_smaller.jpg - (2283.27 KB, 2000x1260) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
2338069

>>3475276

>Also, since the force-feeding of renewable energy into the grids causes load balancing and transmission issue...

And I'm sure that will never, ever be fixed. Keep on believing in your fairy tales.

No.3475283

>>3475281

>No, that's capitalism. If you don't believe me look at the wealth gap in America.

Which, if you remember what we've discussed before, is thanks to the... starts with a "g"

>>3475282

>And I'm sure that will never, ever be fixed. Keep on believing in your fairy tales.

Oh I'm sure it will be fixed, eventually, but how? Meanwhile, halcyon days for the oil and gas industry. Who do you think is pushing for the rampant expansion of renewables without concern for any of the troubles it causes? Those who profit from it, of course.

No.3475285
File: shengyi-sun-0159045672dcdb32f8759f045d6075.jpg - (861.83 KB, 1920x1078) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
882519

>>3475272

>Socialism is fundamentally the argument that the people in the society have a problem - that they themselves cannot see except for a handful of enlightened...

You really do have no idea what actual socialism is do you? Here, listen to the leading professor on socialism in America. https://youtu.be/ysZC0JOYYWw

I know it's not the 4 minute sound bite you like to have your ideas given to you in but if you want to understand the world you need to listen to more than the most simple expressions of ideas.

No.3475287
File: libertarianism1.gif - (1995.08 KB, 360x204) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
2042961

>>3475278

Libertarianism is a crackpot philosophy created by a pus-filled harpie who got lucky by ego-stroking a handful of rich people. If Libertarianism took over, the whole world would literally destroy itself within a decade.

No.3475288

>>3475281

>The very basic idea of socialism is keeping the profit from the workers in the hands of the workers.

False. Profit in socialism is defined entirely differently. What you're referring to is called surplus.

Under socialism, the labor theory of value applies, such that the value of anything is dependent on the amount of collective resources needed to sustain its production. Every job earns you a "living" regadless of what it produces, and what counts as "living" is not dependent on how much you do but what is necessary to sustain you. That is the basis for the socialist economy that Marx described.

Hence, you're not given "profit" for your work - profit doesn't exist - you are appointed a socially (politically) determined amount of food, drink, housing, clothes, cars... to keep you productive, and whatever is left over as a result of your labor goes to the common. From the common, the surplus is used to sustain the other workers who do not produce material surplus, such as street sweepers, accountants, and politburo members.

Therefore, the control of what you understood as "profit", which is the surplus of material and energy left over from what the political class decrees is enough to sustain the people, is left entirely in the hands of the political class. The political class controls both how much wealth is extracted out of the proletariat, and how it is distributed back onto the proletariat - with the absolute power invested in them by the people.

This is the reason why despite all efforts to the contrary to maintain any semblance of social democratic control of the state, the state inevitably fills up with Stalins and Pol Pots and other crooks who turn the state against its people and hoard all their wealth. In fact, it usually happens that there never was any social democratic control to begin with, and the communist regime starts straight off as a coup by the strongest warlord in the region who declares himself the people and then distributes all the wealth to "the people".

No.3475290

>>3475285

>You really do have no idea what actual socialism is do you?

You're mistaking the common leftist hallucinations and fantasies for "actual socialism".

It's a fine idea on paper, in the imaginations of leftist idealists who ignore reality as it contradicts their pretty theories; in practice it does something completely different. The map is not the territory, and what's worse the socialist's map of reality is ripped off the back of a Hegelian children's story book.

No.3475291
File: !B5D4Cq!BGk-$(KGrHqZ,!hoEyrpzTU10BMsNVkd81w--_35.JPG - (16.58 KB, 300x300) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
16983

>>3475288

>The political class controls both how much wealth is extracted out of the proletariat, and how it is distributed back onto the proletariat

Again, if you watch those two videos you will understand how you are fundamentally wrong about what you call socialism.

https://youtu.be/ysZC0JOYYWw

You are talking about capitalism. Your idea of socialism is capitalism but with investors and share holders being replaced by the state. It's still capitalism not socialism, it's just state run capitalism.

You can tell the difference because socialism is about rebuilding the work place so that the power is in the hands of the workers, the workers decide what is produced, where it's produced, and what price it is sold at.

State run capitalism is the state deciding everything and taxing the workers less because they are taking the profits from their labor instead. Under state run capitalism, which is what you think Sanders end goal is, everyone would work for the government and the government would set all the rules.

Real socialism isn't that. It is a total transformation of the economic system that moves past the need for centralized control. Taking control of the state is just Step 1 of getting to socialism. Step 2 is spreading the power of the state (Governance) out to the people.

No.3475293
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46584

Socialism scares the living shit out of the wealthy because all they are, all they ever were, is leaches profiting off the work of others. Socialism takes that away from them. If you work for a steel mill in a socialist society and your steel mill does well, you get the money for that not some guy who inherited a dividend from his great, great grandfather and that makes the 1% shake in their baby seal skin boots.

No.3475294

>>3475291

>You are talking about capitalism. Your idea of socialism is capitalism but with investors and share holders being replaced by the state. It's still capitalism not socialism, it's just state run capitalism.

Nope. I'm talking exactly about socialism. Your little videos are a bunch of semantic smokescreens, because they're talking about what socialism should be, but that's not what socialism is.

Socialism turns into state capitalism when put into practice.

No.3475295

>>3475293

No, you're projecting. Socialism never starts up on it's own. It's like a vine, looking for a strong tree to climb and leech from. There as never been a socialist government without there first being another form of government that it uses as a launch pad in an ill-fated attempted at revolution.

What's stopping you from having a commune right now? Why aren't you and your like minded people pooling resources and buying land to live together on?

One day, the reserves of loot you steal from the rich in your revolution go dry. Then your socialist paradise fails, like it always does, and always has. People stop working under socialism so it always fails.

No.3475296

>>3475291

>the workers decide what is produced, where it's produced, and what price it is sold at.

Haha, nope. The moment you institute socialism, the workers lose control of their workplace because the socialist state does not allow individual businesses to exist. The means of production are collective and involve the entire society. Control of workplaces is handed over to the state, as production, output and prices are socially controlled.

There is no such thing as socialism in a single workplace. A co-op or a worker-owned corporation still exists in a capitalist context, and competes against others in a free market.

No.3475297

>>3475291

>Real socialism isn't that. It is a total transformation of the economic system that moves past the need for centralized control. Taking control of the state is just Step 1 of getting to socialism. Step 2 is spreading the power of the state (Governance) out to the people.

Yep, and it's exactly the step from 1. to 2. that never happens, not in a single socialist state, because the people who take control will not give it back. The people who run your revolution - your socialist vanguard - find themselves in a situation of absolute power and become absolutely corrupt. No matter how well meaning, they will become replaced by machiavellian dictators.

That is the difference between theory and practice.

No.3475299

>>3475293

> If you work for a steel mill in a socialist society and your steel mill does well, you get the money for that

Nope. You get little more than a medal and the right to sit at the front of the bus to work.

The Soviet union tried constantly to equalize payment across all occupations. The "bonuses" paid for the stakhanovite heroes who exceeded their production quotas accounted for approximately 10% of the average worker's real income, while a quarter of the income came from "social wages" which were determined by social status and position much like a caste system. Access to use-value items like automobiles was strictly limited through the social wage system, where you had to apply for a permission to buy a car, and then you had to apply for a permission to buy petrol... etc.

That's real socialism for you. You see, what's real is what really exists - not what exists only in some pretty speech about how great it would all be.

No.3475308

>>3474801

Please tell me what changes (economic wise and budget wise) has Trump done?
Apart from destroying most of the Obama's social legacy that helps immigrants and poor people?

Can't wait to see him cost cut the top 5% taxes again.

No.3475309

>>3475208

Every nation that stood up to try to block the USA from getting resources (Iran, Iraq, Venezuela, etc..)
Have had huge economic blocks, CIA sabotage, economic sabotage and assassinations attempts.

Hardly anything to do with being communist by itself.
Look at CUBA. they barely managed to stay afloat and why? US making the embargo and doing the "If you do business with Cuba, we wont make business with you" creating a chain of block against CUBA interests.

Many of the nations who tried to form a block to protect themselves from US based tax system (aka selling oil for USD in the market, and not using euros or gold).
All of them got sabotaged, bombed, invaded or claimed terrorists. And all of them had US based interventionism.

No.3475313

>>3475309

>Hardly anything to do with being communist by itself.

Yeah, except for the bit where the communist countries were siding with the Soviets in order to spread communism to other countries by force.

And the bit where the Soviet Union shipped nuclear ballistic missiles into Cuba... etc. etc.

No.3475316
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80604

>>3475313

>Soviets in order to spread communism to other countries by force.

you mean similar to how US was bombing the shit out of other nations who wanted to be neutral or join russian interests?
Or even causing full blown military genocidal dictadorships all over the world because of fear of the "ruskies" ?

No.3475323

>>3475316

>you mean similar to how US was bombing the shit out of other nations who wanted to be neutral or join russian interests?

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Proletarian_internationalism

>Proletarian internationalism, sometimes referred to as international socialism, is the perception of all communist revolutions as being part of a single global class struggle rather than separate localized events.[1][2] It is based on the theory that capitalism is an international system, and therefore the working classes of all nations must act in concert if they are to replace it with communism
>Proletarian internationalism is closely linked to goals of world revolution, to be achieved through successive or simultaneous communist revolutions in all nations. According to Marxist theory, successful proletarian internationalism should lead to world communism and eventually stateless communism
>Proletarian internationalism was originally embraced by the Bolshevik Party during its seizure of power in the Russian Revolution.[3] After the formation of the Soviet Union, Marxist proponents of internationalism suggested that country could be used as a "homeland of communism" from which revolution could be spread around the globe.

The "Russian interest" was basically world domination, which gave birth to the Cold War.

No.3475324
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47623

>>3475295

>There as never been a socialist government without there first being another form of government that it uses as a launch pad in an ill-fated attempted at revolution.

Yeah, just like almost every nation ever founded started off involving slavery but those nations evolve from brutal, primitive tribal societies into modern societies. By your own measure, Capitalism is the primitive, barbarian version of economics that society is driven to rise above.

No.3475325

>>3475316
The difference between US and Russian attacks on a country is that the Americans usually have the good sense to leave, whereas the Russians are there to stay.

The difference is in the motive. The capitalist society wants to do trade with you, where the socialist society wants to own you.

No.3475326

>>3475324

>By your own measure, Capitalism is the primitive, barbarian version of economics that society is driven to rise above.

Capitalism is the result of the state of matters when the people are free to pursue their own interests, in the absence of a tyrannical state to force them on gunpoint to conform to some arbitrary standard of conduct. It is the fallback where every society returns once they've had enough of "social experiments" that inevitably turn sour.

In every socialist society, as time passes and things generally fall onto their tracks, the people institute a capitalistic shadow economy of black markets and informal infrastructure which bypasses the state system and allows them to live more or less normally.

For example, in the Soviet Union, people took discarded x-ray sheets and used them to cut copies of western pop-music vinyls for underground distribution, as the state could not allow such "counter-revolutionary" influences to pass.

No.3475328
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337689

>>3475297

>the workers lose control of their workplace because the socialist state does not allow individual businesses to exist.
>One day, the reserves of loot you steal from the rich in your revolution go dry. Then your socialist paradise fails, like it always does, and always has. People stop working under socialism so it always fails.

Again, you are taking this to a super-far extreme. You want there to be a boogieman controlling a socialist state in total control of the nation for you to rebel against but that's not what anyone is talking about.

Socialism is a tool that we want to use to address very specific key needs of the people. Things that are better when they don't involve the boom and bust cycle that are inherent in capitalism.

Environmental safety, infrastructure, health care, education, internet, public safety, basic living income, economic regulations, things the work force needs to have be stable and reliable so they will be happy and productive. That's it.

Socialism is great providing the core needs of a society and capitalism can take care of the rest because as long as we have the stability of the socialist safety net, no matter how big the capitalist crash is, the nation will survive.

Unfettered capitalism destroys nations and frankly it's bad for business in the long run because, as many nations are showing, once you put so much money in the hands of the people at the top, the system collapses and that money becomes worthless paper. Your bonds and stock options are toilet paper if the society you are working in falls apart. Capitalists need judiciously applied socialism as much as everyone else.

The most successful places on earth have democratic socialist policies. Their people are the healthiest, the most educated, the happiest, the longest lived, you just like to pretend those places don't exist because they make unfettered capitalism look like a bad investment.

No.3475329

Just because a society overtakes a previous society doesn't make it progress. If you truly believe that, then Israel has a right to exist and maintain it's current borders because it is backed by might and was established in the wake of war.

Or what happened to the native americans is entirely justified because living on log cabins was more civilized and evolved than living in teepee.

>>3475324

>>Yeah, just like almost every nation ever founded started off involving slavery but those nations evolve from brutal, primitive tribal societies into modern societies.

Yeah nice weasel word there... except slavery was not there at founding. You are completely retarded in your understanding of slavery.

Slavery only came on as a nation was large enough to begin needing to find more resources and land than the civilization currently had access to... Even then, slavery was not immediate. Slavery was actually a moral evolution because prior to slavery, a warring nation would whole-sale slaughter every single person that lived in a region that was beaten in war. Before slavery, losing a war meant you were dead, your kids were dead, and your wife was dead or rape meat.

>>By your own measure, Capitalism is the primitive, barbarian version

I'll stop you right there, primitive doesn't mean bad. If you create an economic system that requires an intense level of intervention, and then the intervening body is damaged or retarded in any way, then the system collapses. It is not tolerant to war, natural disasters or unexpected events.

It's like having a purely digital gas oven with no analogue parts versus having a gas oven that has a pilot light. If power is knocked out, I can still cook and eat. I can still boil water. Not true if my gas oven is digitally controlled and non-functional because of it.

No.3475331

Also... still didn't answer why all you socialists don't start a commune. You're free to cohabitate, share resources, and decide as a group what you're gonna sell on etsy to live off of.

I mean shit, college dropouts and NEETs are living 5 men to a house, why the fuck can't you socialists do it?

No.3475332

>>3475328

I'm not taking this to the super far extreme, socialists who are wanting to replace the republic with socialism are.

They do not want a democratic republic with socialist policies. They want to throw down democracy because things like Trump happen. They want above-base-needs basic income for doing nothing.

Who the fuck pays for that? This shit can't be wishful-thinking'd into existence.

No.3475334

In one sense, socialism is not progress but a return to feudalism.

In feudalism, the order of society was ordained by God who had a historical purpose for the people, which "naturally" put people in their places and set the social hierarchy and distribution of wealth: first the king, then the priests, nobility/aristocracy, and peasants toiling away in their communes.

In socialism God is replaced by the faith in an abstract "society" that has a historical destiny and purpose for the people, which sets the social order and distribution of wealth: first the leader, then the party, then the intelligentsia and other sycophants, and then the proletariat toiling away in ther communes.

In either system, if you disagree with the king and priests, or their socialist equivalents, you're branded a heretic and imprisoned or killed. Both systems also expand to take up all resources from rival societies, and both systems fall as they grow, because they end up spending too much time and effort simply policing themselves.

No.3475336

>>3475328

>You want there to be a boogieman controlling a socialist state in total control of the nation

I don't want it to be. I observe it to be the case.

>Socialism is a tool that we want to use to address very specific key needs of the people.

Socialism is not a tool that is necessary to address these needs. Socialism isn't even a good tool to solve these issues because it creates the very issues it claims to solve: inequality, tyranny of the few, and economic inefficiency.

No.3475337

>>3475328

>Environmental safety, infrastructure, health care, education,

The worst examples of environmental neglect come from existing and former socialist states. Their infrastructure has almost universally been shit, and the only example of good health care in socialism is Cuba where the state enslaves people to be doctors in order to sell them abroad.

> internet

Like the Great Firewall in China, right? Socialist states are the worst at censoring free use of information to protect the elite's intellectual hegemony.

>public safety, basic living income,

Ditto. Socialist countries are nearly universally shitholes where the law-enforcement tends to be involved in as much crime as the criminals themselves

>economic regulations,

Like the perpetual inflation we're having now, as the governments are trying to prevent recessions by printing more money? In trying to control the economy, the socialist simply misplaces resources by not letting them flow where they are most needed.

>things the work force needs to have be stable and reliable so they will be happy and productive. That's it.

The state is incompetent in providing this stability. The very attempt at forcing the economy to be stable causes systemic problems to mount and grow until small problems and small reversible perturbations turn into huge issues and economic collapses, mass unemployment and general mayhem.

No.3475343
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65476

>>3475329

>If you truly believe that, then Israel has a right to exist and maintain it's current borders because it is backed by might and was established in the wake of war.

Actually I do. I mean, it sucks for Palestine but they lost. Shit happens. The only problem I have with the Gaza strip is how they have turned it into a prison they literally launch bombs at from time to time. If they would just kick the Palestinians out I would be A-OK with that. End the violence. Let those people move somewhere better. Hell, America could relocate the entire Palestine population and it's not like there aren't plenty of other places they could go in the middle east.

At this point it's a religious war and that is always just a really, really, fucking stupid thing to die for.

No.3475348
>181 posts and 87 images omitted.

Come on 3B - argue some more, so close!

No.3475349

>>3475336

>tyranny of the few...

You keep using this phrase, what do you mean by this. Like, lets say Medicare for all passes, what exactly do you believe is going to happen?

No.3475351

>>3475343

> I mean, it sucks for Palestine but they lost. Shit happens

The Khmer Rouge massacred millions in the name of socialism.

>Shit happens

Trump won

>arglebarlgle shillary shillary bernie bernie waaa!
No.3475352

>>3475349

> Like, lets say Medicare for all passes, what exactly do you believe is going to happen?

That's like saying "Cows can fly; discuss". The real question is, how does it come to?

You answer that, and I'll answer you.

No.3475360

>>3475349

Let me put it this way; let's look at reality for a moment. Trump is the president now, because approximately half the people voted him to office, and Trump isn't going to pass Medicare for all. It's not unreasonable to assume then that half the people don't support Medicare either, or the ACA etc. so it's currently impossible to pass the law.

So how can Medicare for all pass? Well, we could make it happen if enough people stand up and decide that this is such an important matter that it overrides democracy - that all these other people are just being dumb or evil and their opinions should not count - so we have to make such a big fuss about it and make up so much trouble that everyone else has to agree to pass it. We go on strikes, we march on the streets, we extort and hold the rest of the society hostage until we get what we want.

But how are we going to do that? Well, we need a spearhead, a vanguard of people to agitate the population, to polarize the issue and argue why what we're doing is the right thing. But will the other side sit idle and just take it? Of course not - so we have to make sure that once we emerge as victors we can actually hold that position, so our vanguard needs to seize control of the whole society to suppress dissent and re-educate everyone.

And where are we then as a society? Tyranny.

So you see, some individual fact like "Medicare for all passes" is just an end to means. It doesn't mean anything - the means by which you gain it mean everything. If your means to achieve it is socialism, you've set yourself on a path of destruction, as your institutions are now based on strong-arming your way to social progress and while that may work for a bit, it will bite you back later as your very institutions get taken over by people who use the power for their own ends. The benevolent dictator will inevitably be superceded by the malevolent dictator.

No.3475373
File: Winston_Churchill.png - (213.12 KB, 446x335) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
218235

>>3475352

>How could medicare possibly come to pass.

There is a bill in congress right now. All they have to do is talk enough Republicans into the idea that Medicare for all would be less expensive for America than what we have now. This should be relatively easy since it's, you know, true.

They will start out by making medicare an option for everyone instead of limiting it to the elderly. Millions of people will opt in. Rich people will throw a fit because it will cost them a few dollars a year in extra taxes and heaven forbid they can't have all the monies all the time.

Even if they get it past congress, which may actually happen because it would help both the GOP and the Dems become more popular, Trump will sink it. Then the GOP can distance themselves from Trump.

Big picture, they want him out of office. Of course the Democrats are going to help them because they are too fucking stupid to realize that if they tied the GOP to Trump every horrible thing that he does would help the DNC win elections. Their instinct to lose at everything will take over and they will act like Trump is a monster, not a "normal Republican"

By excusing the actions of the GOP and blaming it all on Trump they will set themselves up to lose in 2018 because people are tired of losing and in 2020 they will put up both Cory Booker and Kamala Harris. Sanders will run against them (Assuming he's alive) to push them left. Cory will win because he's the establishment shill for big pharma backed by Obama. Then no matter how much people demand it medicare for all will not happen.

2024 a Republican will win, then it will happen because unlike Democrats, Republicans are smart enough to know a winning idea when it's handed to them and by that time the cost of not being on medicare for all will be so astronomical that they will be seen as heroes for enacting this bold new plan in spite of the Corporatist Democrats interference.

No.3475375
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32107

>>3475373

No.3475376
File: churchill_socialism_quote.jpg - (20.35 KB, 448x222) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
20837

>>3475373

No.3475378

Satire alert! But damn this is a vicious and on target take down of the Wall Street whore.

“From my agent negotiating that underwhelming deal with Simon & Schuster, to the graphic designer’s lackluster cover art, to my so-called supporters who couldn’t be bothered to drop $17.99 for the hardcover copy—everyone had a hand in undermining my last book’s success,” reads a passage from the introduction to Clinton’s What Also Happened, which repeatedly decries her prior book’s “indecipherable” font and dedicates an entire chapter to lashing out at her copy editor for making her look like “an idiot third-grader.”

http://www.theonion.com/article/clinton-already-working-follow-book-casting-blame--56870?utm_content=Main&utm_campaign=SF&utm_source=Facebook&utm_medium=SocialMarketing

And in contrast a smart fact based take-down of $hillary by those enemies of right-wingers and neo-liberals: intelligent progressives: https://youtu.be/6zeGUiTL9Ak

No.3475380

>>3475376 <--- Clearly someone to fucking retarded to realize what the US military is, not to mention public roads, public utilities, public schools, firefighters, public libraries...need I go on.

No.3475381
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40357

>>3475373

No.3475383
File: Margaret-Thatcher-Quotes-5.jpg - (191.64 KB, 2000x947) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
196241

>>3475380
That's not socialism, you're just retarded.

No.3475389
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613280

>>3475383

Yes, remember the rules. If it's proven to work it can't be socialism because socialism always fails and no amount of evidence or logic can ever be allowed to change that. LOL!!

No.3475390
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191254

>>3475376

It's not surprising you like Churchill. He was the Trump of his day.

A extremist warmonger who got into power through corruption and bribing his enemies, promising to kill civilians in retaliations for the Nazi strikes while secretly trying to negotiate peace with Hitler through back channels to save his own ass. He constantly bitched about socialism then helped institute a “from the cradle to the grave.” social security system.

He promised one thing then did the opposite, lied to everyone all the time. Declared himself the best man in politics until people believed it even though he was wildly unpopular.

The only difference was he was actually competent and he had a war to prop him up. Why do you think Trump is trying to start one now? Churchill is his hero to.

http://foreignpolicy.com/2015/06/04/churchill-the-political-war-leader/
http://www.huffingtonpost.com/kipp-friedman/donald-trumpthe-winston-c_b_7824018.html
http://www.cnn.com/2017/01/20/politics/trump-churchill-oval-office/index.html

No.3475404

Churchill was also a massive racist and Hitler could easily have had him as an ally if he hadn't been completely buttfucking stupid. Churchill often spoke of "Aryan superiority".

The UK pretends all that never happened though. They idolize him as if he were some man of peace and love who fought hard against a bad man. Dr Who paints him as some great man that the Doctor considers a friend. Then again this is the BBC, a network that knew Jimmy Savile was a pedophile and covered it up for decades because outing it could have cost them money- money they barely spend on any of their shows.

No.3475408

>>3475325

>The difference between US and Russian attacks on a country is that the Americans usually have the good sense to leave.

Yeah riight. They will sure leave you alone as long theres a puppet that goes to support US interests.
The moment you switch they bomb the shit out of you.

>>3475325

>The capitalist society wants to do trade with you, where the socialist society wants to own you.

Wrong again, the Capitalistic elites of the country that is in power, wants to OWN YOU by destroying local competition and setting giant conglomerates that control everything.

I guess you never went out of the USA right?

>>3475334
Feudalism is far right. Almost all the way to the other side of the spectrum of total socialism. near the King totalitarian.

No.3475410
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218924

>>3475337

>Chinese firewall

You mean the type of censoring that far right republicans wants to insert into the internt to control everything?
Or how about the removal of net neutrality which will lead to company-controlled blocks?

>>3475337

>Ditto. Socialist countries are nearly universally shitholes where the law-enforcement tends to be involved in as much crime as the criminals themselves

The US isnt that far behind with all the scandals of Cops shooting negroes for whatever reason they make up. And then get cleared up by some "internal investigation" lead by racists.

>>3475351
Two wrongs dont make it a right..
Why everyone has to resort to "this massacre is worse!" its not a fucking contest.

>>3475360
Meh, Id say less than 30% voted for him in total of US population.

>>3475373
Except the big pharma lobbyists do not want this to happen.
They will block anything that will lower their money sources.
The US is literally a shithole for medical.
100 USD for a fucking gauze that costs 3 USD outside the hospital? I mean common!

>>3475373

>Republicans are smart enough to know a winning idea when it's handed to them and by that time the cost of not being on medicare for all will be so astronomical that they will be seen as heroes for enacting this bold new plan in spite of the Corporatist Democrats interference.

Smart enough to lure the idiotic hardcore right that eats the "Obama birth certificate is false!" and "they taking muh guns!"

>>3475381

No.3475413
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44003

>>3475389
Public libraries aren't socialism because I can still go to bookstore to purchase the book for my own personal use or download it to my Kindle to read on my own time. If public libraries were socialism, only they would be allowed to control all the books. I would only be allowed to read those books approved by a cabal of government bureaucrats and they would dictate when, where and how often I may read them. Capitalism allows for public resources just as it allows for charity.

>>3475390

>It's not surprising you like Churchill. He was the Trump of his day.

Hey now, you're the one who started quoting him. I just figured you'd enjoy a few more of his quotes filled with sagely advice nicely packaged into a convenient meme! :3

No.3475414
File: chinese_socialism_sucks.jpg - (284.88 KB, 1800x1800) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
291713

>>3475410

>You mean the type of censoring that far right republicans wants to insert into the internt to control everything?

No, the lengths the socialists in China go to control, restrict and censor information is nowhere as bad as Republicans who mostly just wants to ban tits and swear words, not freedom of thought.

>The US isnt that far behind with all the scandals of Cops shooting negroes for whatever reason they make up.

You're right, the cops should shoot everybody indiscriminately and have no need to even bother with a made up reason to justify it. /s

>The US is literally a shithole for medical.

If that's true then why do all those socialist bureaucrats and elites come over to the US to skip the lines in their own countries to enjoy all the advanced medical breakthroughs we're constantly creating?

No.3475428

>>3475390

>>Warmonger.
>>Secretly negotiates peace.
>>Ebil Trump forerunner hates caring for people.
>>Etablishes safety net.

Dude, you're including the reasons you're wrong and exaggerating in your own post. These are literally contradictory statements to how you are characterizing him.

No.3475432

>>3475373

> All they have to do is talk enough Republicans into the idea that Medicare for all would be less expensive for America than what we have now. This should be relatively easy since it's, you know, true.

That's besides the point, though the effort is valiant.
a) it's going to take a long time to convince the people that such a program actually works, and that the government won't simply botch it up like they usually do
b) a lot of people don't object to medicare on the basis of cost, but on the values it represents. A ton of medicare cost would be due to people's own life choices such as obesity, drug use etc. and to that the republican is inclined to say "you did it, you pay for it".

No.3475445
File: Spike-reading-something-my-little-pony-friendship-is-magic-28606431-500-561.jpg - (41.38 KB, 500x561) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
42377

>>3475428

He was a warmonger who was trying to save HIS OWN ASS, read the whole sentence, cunt. He was trying to work out a deal where if he let Hitler take over he and his rich friends would be spared. He was a traitor.

He is also like Trump because he claimed to be very anti-socialist but when the parliament implemented social security he just let it happen, breaking his promise to his supporters. He didn't care about anyone but himself and what favors he could get.

If you READ the links you would have understood that but you are a hopeless, ignorant cunt and you don't want to change.

No.3475447
File: DJgcEMyW4AA48Z2.jpg - (40.24 KB, 500x432) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
41205

>>3475432

>A ton of medicare cost would be due to people's own life choices such as obesity, drug use etc. and to that the republican is inclined to say "you did it, you pay for it".

The majority of people don't think that way any more because even if you believe that's true, you know they wont pay for it. You will. Everyone will. People who fuck up their lives usually don't have the money to fix themselves and we all end up towing the cost.

It's better to make the most effective system possible because you are going to be paying one way or another and letting it just spin out of control just makes it all the more expensive in the long run.

No.3475450
File: Losing-Arguments.jpeg - (121.87 KB, 416x375) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
124791

>>3475445

>WARGLEBARGLE “OMG UR A CUNT U CUNT LOL” BARGLE!!

I like when 43B (inevitably) starts losing the argument, gets flustered, and resorts to school-yard insults.

No.3475453
File: Ask_Yourself_.png - (199.35 KB, 446x822) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
204134

>>3475450

Neither of us are losing the argument because he's wrong and he refuses to look at any new evidence. I'm done arguing with him. Arguing with Clinton supporters is like arguing with religious people. You can't convince them. They have to come to the conclusion they are wrong on their own. It's a cult. Nothing we say is going to change their mind.

No.3475472

>>3475453
You've been losing this whole thread, starting with the book sales comparison where you had no proof Bernie's low sales numbers were due to anything but waning interest, to explaining how Venezuela collapsed despite their socialism while another oil-dependent nation like Saudi Arabia continues to flourish, and now with this laughable attempt to explain how expanding Medicare to everybody will be implemented with Paul Ryan controlling the House and Trump in the White House.

No.3475473
File: Entitlement.png - (338.85 KB, 1154x542) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
346978

I have to wonder what the Clintonites will do now that their queen has been kicked out of the race by the party.

The DNC has turned on her because she committed the unforgivable sin: She took donors away from the DNC.

http://www.washingtonexaminer.com/amazon-walmart-slash-hillary-clintons-what-happened-40-before-tuesday-release/article/2634030

http://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2017/sep/11/judge-order-clinton-lawyers-face-bar-investigation/

http://thehill.com/opinion/campaign/350237-clinton-should-back-sanders-medicare-for-all-bill

https://www.usatoday.com/story/opinion/2017/09/12/readers-sound-off-hillary-stop-alienating-bernie-supporters/655319001/

https://www.bloomberg.com/news/features/2017-09-12/why-american-workers-pay-twice-as-much-in-taxes-as-wealthy-investors

https://www.vox.com/policy-and-politics/2017/9/12/16293016/sanders-single-payer-health-care

http://thefederalist.com/2017/09/12/yes-hillary-the-media-did-help-trump-win-so-did-you/

No.3475475
File: 40Percent_Off_Before_its_Ever_Sold.png - (129.02 KB, 1311x525) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
132113

>>3475472

>Hillary's books are selling better than Bernie's books...

Which is why they cut the price 40% to get more sales? Much more likely, Amazon put the book at #1 assuming it would get a lot of sales while on Pre-order then very few people purchased it and they had to lower the price to get enough people to buy it to justify the #1 spot when the actual sales numbers come out.

No.3475476
File: 1268784283.shin0r0z_femalegabenewell.png - (168.14 KB, 626x729) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
172180

>>3475472

> to explaining how Venezuela collapsed despite their socialism while another oil-dependent nation like Saudi Arabia continues to flourish...

No, I explained it, I explained it as simply as possible, you're just too angry or stupid to accept the evidence. I'm done explaining it. Go back and actually read the replies if you want to understand, but you don't. You would rather be angry and ignorant than truthful.

No.3475483
File: Hillary_Clinton_sells_out_literally.png - (152.15 KB, 658x319) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
155800

>>3475475
Well, she doubled the price of the tickets for her book tour...and she's still selling out in city after city. Her book is still strong at #6 while Bernie's book has completely dropped off the map less than a month later.

http://www.chicagotribune.com/news/chicagoinc/ct-clinton-tickets-0908-chicago-inc-20170906-story.html

I guess without Putin funding all of those bots, now you can kinda get a feel for just how little support Bernie Sanders actually has.

No.3475484
File: saudi-arabia-gdp.png - (18.22 KB, 730x340) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
18659

>>3475476
If you can't be bothered then I'm willing to give a quick recap as the resident Oil&Gas expert.

Venezuela lost a third of it's GDP when oil prices collapsed, Saudi Arabia lost a third of it's GDP when oil prices collapsed (pic related).

Venezuela, burdened by socialist policies, failed to save and invest their oil money, while Saudi Arabia, unburdened by socialist policies, did save and invest their oil money.

Now Venezuela is completely fucked because they wasted their money with socialism while Saudi Arabia breathes easily because it didn't waste money with socialism.

Remember kids, a theocratic monarchy is a superior system to socialism.

No.3475485
File: kamala-harris-2020.png - (87.73 KB, 640x640) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
89838

>>3475473

>I have to wonder what the Clintonites will do now that their queen has been kicked out of the race by the party.

I'll tell you what I'm gonna do. I'm gonna call you can autistic retard because you know I've been pushing both Cory Booker and Kamala Harris for the past couple of months. Trust me, I'd love nothing more than for Hillary to take on Donald Trump for a rematch in 2020, but it became clear a couple months ago that she's done with politics. Now she's going to sit back for a much-deserved rest as she adds to her millions with a new book.

See, I don't have the problem you have. Without Bernie, you have nothing. For me, there are plenty of candidates I can get behind. But I think it may be Kamala, since we're already getting her prepped by making sure her home state of California (and it's jackpot of delegates) occurs early in the primary this time around.

http://www.politico.com/story/2017/09/10/california-could-jolt-2020-presidential-elections-242530

No.3475488
File: 2016_election_results.png - (262.26 KB, 730x403) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
268557

>>3475485
Doesn't matter. Why do you think Trump never even bothered to visit California despite all those juicy delegates there? It's because the state has been lost for any Republican win for awhile now because of all the liberals, illegals, crookedness and so forth going on. But that's ok, they don't need it, so they just write it off. why do you think Trump won anyway? Because of the Electoral College where, BY LAW, the STATES vote for the President. So next time, California could have a 4 million popular vote lead again, or 50 million, or 100 million more popular votes. It doesn't affect THE OTHER 49 STATES THAT CHOOSE THE PRESIDENT. You can have 200 Million more popular votes and STILL LOSE.

No.3475489

>>3475488

And rightly so. If not, all you would need to do to rule the country is intentionally create pro-fertility policies, sit back, and wait.

No.3475490

>>3475488 >>3475488 Californians don't vote republican because california isn't a cesspool of ignorance and lack of education. Californians are actually smart enough to look at how red states across the board almost dominate every bottom ten list of every measurable metric of human wellbeing, and aren't stupid enough to vote for people pushing such laughably retarded policy that's so obviously intended to do nothing but make the richest people in the country just little more rich at everybody elses expense.

I mean go look at least educated states hahaha. You people are the only people stupid enough to vote for these scumbags.

At least the democrats who've now become republican light throw in policies that actually benefit their constituents. They have to because democrats aren't fucking retarded enough to vote just based on promises of repealing supreme court case law that can't ever be repealed.

No.3475493
File: rainbowsunicorns-fb-min-1.png - (24.01 KB, 851x315) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
24583

It only appears that way to you because most Republicans don't live in fairy-tale la-la land.

No.3475496

>>3475493
Fucking rightwingers live in the biggest fairytale la-la land. These are the people who made Joel Osteen a multi-millionaire. Dumb fuckers are wrong about literally everything imaginable, and then instead of learning from their mistakes they double down.

No.3475497
File: Kamala_Harris_Friend_Of_Banks.png - (200.99 KB, 553x772) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
205816

>>3475485

>Cory Booker and Kamala Harris...

HAHAHAHA Good luck with that. He's already on the record voting against reducing prices for medication by breaking up monopolies and blocking a bill by Sanders to let Americans buy drugs from Canada at half the cost.

Kamala on the other hand is the banks number 1 whore. No one likes the banks and she literally helped them escape justice time and time again after ruining people's lives.

No.3475501
File: bank_fraud_bernie.jpg - (122.20 KB, 640x573) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
125136

>>3475497
Oh, I know you're already coming up with bullshit to distract from the fact that all you have is an some kike who'll be in his fucking 80's if he were to become president in 2020. Maybe that'll work against a guy who literally saved a woman from a burning building, but I'm not so sure about that.

So good luck with that as the FBI closes in on that fat fugly wife of his and the lawsuits pile up against him because Bernie continues to fail to pay his bills despite being a millionaire.

No.3475503
File: kamala-harris-schools-EPA-head.jpg - (237.56 KB, 500x379) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
243259

>>3475488
That may be the case, but I'm talking about the Democratic Primary, not the general election. Although the schedule will randomly vary every cycle, Iowa and New Hampshire typically come first with California typically being last. This will tend to disadvantage Democrats from California as they can't benefit from the home field advantage, where politicians typically win their home states with few exceptions.

Hillary and Donald Trump won New York in their respective primaries, Bernie won Vermont, Ted Cruz won Texas and John Kasich won Ohio. Marco Rubio was a rare exception when Trump beat him in Florida. This is a move to push California ahead because it's clear Kamala Harris is seriously considering a run in 2020 and the state wants to be able to help give one of their own a headstart over the competition. If California jumps ahead to March, then she'll most likely get a huge delegate bump earlier in the race to give her the momentum to clinch the nomination.

No.3475504
File: ap_237012274056.png - (286.24 KB, 541x405) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
293110

>>3475501

Yeah, that's a bullshit republican talking point. It's already been discredited.

http://digital.vpr.net/post/catholic-church-rejects-claim-sanders-wife-caused-financial-harm#stream/0

http://wjla.com/news/nation-world/source-of-allegation-vs-bernie-sanders-wife-admits-info-was-hearsay

https://www.pastemagazine.com/articles/2017/05/investigating-nothing-the-jane-sanders-fbi-non-con.html

No.3475505
File: 1503604778974-GettyImages-510264550.jpeg - (57.20 KB, 850x476) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
58574

>>3475503

>Kamala will get a huge head start if California goes first.

Yeah, I'm sure that her and Cory and Sanders and Tulsi and possibly Warren will not at all split the vote in the most informed, liberal state in America.

No.3475513

>>3475504

Pretty much this. Only dumbfuck trumpets believed that shit in the first place. Anything they can do to cling to their failed president and their white supremacist party.

No.3475518
File: jane-better-lawyer-up.jpg - (54.32 KB, 800x416) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
55623

>>3475504
Yep, it's so untrue that Bernie and Jane Sanders retained expensive lawyers because there's clearly no case. Even though there is an open FBI investigation, there's no reason whatsoever for them to be concerned and it'll have no impact on a future presidential run. It's not like every major news outlet has run a story on this or anything, right?

https://www.cbsnews.com/news/bernie-and-jane-sanders-under-fbi-investigation-for-bank-fraud-hire-lawyers/

http://www.politico.com/magazine/story/2017/06/22/bernie-sanders-jane-sanders-lawyer-bank-fraud-investigation-burlington-college-215297

http://www.huffingtonpost.com/entry/bernie-sanders-jane-sanders-fbi-investigation_us_594fc816e4b0da2c731c2d1d

http://www.cnn.com/2017/06/27/politics/bernie-sanders-jane-sanders-burlington-college/index.html

http://www.foxnews.com/politics/2017/06/25/sanders-wife-jane-hire-lawyers-amid-fbi-probe-on-loan-application-report.html

No.3475519
File: kamala-makes-you-nervous.jpg - (72.23 KB, 500x666) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
73967

>>3475505

>Yeah, I'm sure that her and Cory and Sanders and Tulsi and possibly Warren will not at all split the vote in the most informed, liberal state in America.

Again, you don't seem to quite understand the concept of the home field advantage. Also, while the DNC may push Warren and Tulsi to run to siphon off voters from Bernie, at this point, I don't think that both Cory Booker and Kamala Harris will run at the same time. That's bad news for you because Bernie couldn't even come close to dislodging Hillary when he had no other competition.

Now I know you have a laundry list of excuses for your 2016 failure, but I suggest you just keep them on ice because I have a feeling you'll be using them again in 2020 to make you feel better about your impending and repeated crushing defeat.

No.3475537

>>3475519 Why are you such a apologist for the neo-libs of the democratic party? Are you just another corporate cocksucker? https://youtu.be/3lvTSss9KkE?t=1m22s

No.3475553
File: aZ4VvhU.jpg - (668.17 KB, 3264x2448) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
684202

>>3475518

>But she got a lawyer. If she was innocent she wouldn't need a lawyer.

You are a dumbass of an epic level. Of course she hired a lawyer. Her lawyer is there to give the FBI the information they request. If she didn't hire a lawyer she would have to do everything herself. Everyone hires a lawyer to handle it when the FBI starts an investigation. Even your queen, Hillary.

No.3475554
File: Bernie_Card.png - (355.15 KB, 456x646) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
363677

>>3475519

>Again, you don't seem to quite understand the concept of the home field advantage.

Again you miss the point. I'm not saying she won't have an advantage. I'm saying that it's wasted by using that advantage at the start of the race when there are so many people to dilute the vote pool. If she had waited until there was only her and one other person then her advantage would be more valuable. Not everyone will be in the race all the way. If she had waited, it would have gotten her more total votes.

No.3475555

>>3475554
Okay, so what're your thoughts on the fact that both Harris and Warren (along with about a dozen others) are cosponsoring Sanders' "Medicare for All" bill?
http://www.cnn.com/2017/09/13/politics/bernie-sanders-medicare-for-all-plan-details/index.html

No.3475568
File: usar-if-you-think-cops-never-harass-white-people-youveobviousli-14640784.png - (160.70 KB, 500x508) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
164557

>>3475518

You mean someone who promotes ideas for the working man is corrupt?

Bernie's been playing this game forever. He tried the "working man's" life, but sucked at it. Then he figured out he could promise stuff to idiots, get rich and end up being what he wanted.

You don't wind up with 3 houses, an Audi sportscar, and defrauding banks because you're some poor, underdog, just wanting what's right for people because you're so selfless.

No.3475575

>>3475555

It's easy to act progressive when the congress and white house is controlled by the GOP and a man-baby. The bill will never pass and we all know it. This is just Sander's way of pushing them left so that when they run they will have to keep supporting it and not flipflop.

I doubt Sanders has any plans to actually be president, he is just pushing them to be more liberal because liberal wins, corporatism doesn't.

No.3475577
File: DJowjwFUMAAlFTv.jpg - (134.00 KB, 752x851) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
137211

>>3475475

In a Hillary book sales update, in order to further justify the #1 slot Amazon had to erase hundreds of negative reviews. They can't let the queen of corruption seem like she is anything other than perfect, right?

No.3475578
File: obama-single-payer-health-care-cartoon.jpg - (34.81 KB, 497x375) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
35649

>>3475577

>In a Hillary book sales update, in order to further justify the #1 slot Amazon had to erase hundreds of negative reviews.

Yeah, they got rid of all the manufactured negative reviews from bot accounts that never actually purchased the book. Why don't you spend that time to buy, read and review Bernie's book instead of trying to land a cheap shot on Hillary and then getting slapped back down into your place.

>>3475575

>The bill will never pass and we all know it.

Of course, because he didn't actually write anything in the bill. He even specifically refused to include a mechanism for paying for his plan which is a requirement to getting it passed. Those who are even thinking about considering a presidential run are going to endorse it, paying lip service to the far-left. Then they'll just pull an Obama and rescind their "support" for single-payer.

No.3475587

>>3475484
oversight of government officials thinking that the gravy train is going to last forever isnt a thing exclusively of Socialist nations.
Look at Greece and Italy for example.

No.3475588

>>3475488
You know that the majority of oppressed people tend to migrate to places they feel safer too?

Why do you think so many people leave small towns in the bible belt or similar shitholes and move into big cities that are progressive?

They are less likely being discriminated in those towns. Hence why these big cities end being mostly liberal or democratic voting centers and the smaller towns reinforce their shit far right religious beliefs.

That is why there is a disproportionate lean of potential voters in cities toward democrats vs smaller cities and farmland towns towards republican.

No.3475589

>>3475490
>>3475493

I really don't think you even believe the bullshit you write.

Less Education? the democratic cities and blue states have ALWAYS demonstrated higher IQ and levels of education.
A ton of red states are still living in the dark ages of christianity and refusal of science.

Red states are the idiots who fund megachurches.

>>3475504
The worst is that the political machine wants Sanders down at all costs. They refuse to knowledge that the case has zero ground to advance and still claim Sanders is a fraud and under investigation (to undermine him politically)

>>3475553
Agree.
The whole "if you're not guilty..." is one of the dumbest things that can seriously damage your ability to defend yourself and probably lose something (in a person case against the law abuse, losing things like freedom)

>>3475568
Funny, because that sounds like reading Trumps's biography.

>>3475577
Lol, like I said before, most of these reviews probably were by bots or fake accounts that never bought the book. Could be from the Republican camp or russian camp (take your pick).

No.3475595
File: dvAkjK1.jpg - (144.08 KB, 1200x583) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
147541

Just when you thought Hillary couldn't get any more delusional, she concluded in her book that the take away from 1984 was that we must never stop trusting the government and always be obedient.

http://dailycaller.com/2017/09/13/hillary-clinton-thinks-moral-of-1984-is-that-we-should-trust-the-government-and-media/

No.3475596

So apropos of nothing, reports out of Myanmar are that Muslims there are being targeted by Buddhists - not exactly a combination you think of, compared to Hindu/Muslim and Jewish/Muslim tensions.

No.3475597

Never forget that Trump was good friends with Hillary and Bill- a useless redneck and a shit self-serving woman who murdered a business partner.

They're both fraudulent and unfit to be president.

Of course Bernie doesn't plan to be president. he's old and the MPAA/RIAA/bankers/whatever won't allow him to tax them. I'm surprised Metallica hasn't dedicated a song bashing him

>wonder who they'd plagiarize for that masterpiece

Know why leftist celebs went with Hillary? She had a chance. They knew Bernie had no chance, and they didn't want him taking their "hard earned" money that they NEED for luxury cars. Oh boy, Henry Rollins loved Bernie, literally who? What's he done lately beyond casually remind people he's not dead? His music is fucking boring and no one ever bought it. He tries to act thoughtful but you can only look so smart when you're friends with a low-IQ no-talent sellout violent racist manlet like Glenn Danzig.

Protests don't change shit, the people in power do not listen and you obstruct traffic. Votign doesn' tmatter, they can count however they feel like and stick in whomever they wish, you can't even genuinely get the real votes verified and you know it. It's a show. Violence changes things. The Revolutionary War was not protests or votes, it was actions.

You're too pussified to fight. /pol/ pretends the rich New York kike is on their side, leftists pretend they have power because they typefuck Facebook and pretend their driving hybrid cars saves the planet. You reap what you sow.

No.3475602
File: 174278_600.jpg - (83.91 KB, 600x342) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
85922

>>3475597

>She had a chance. They knew Bernie had no chance...

Except for all the polling on election day showing he would have easily won by 9%-12% where as your girl lost.

No.3475603
>>Less Education? the democratic cities and blue states have ALWAYS demonstrated higher IQ and levels of education.

Well, come back and tell us again about that higher education after Trump gets re-elected in 2020.

>>Why do you think so many people leave small towns in the bible belt or similar shitholes and move into big cities that are progressive?

It can't be for the reasons you state, because most big cities' population consists MAINLY of some of the dumbest-ass Niggers and retarded Mexicans you ever encountered in your lifetime. They take stupid to a whole new level, almost as bad as you do. Stop making up shit to fit your own agenda.

No.3475613

>>3475597

>They knew Bernie had no chance

Had plenty and was outright sabotaged by Pro Hillary leaders in the party.
The emails told a clear image.

Didn't help the famous rumours of random disfranchisement (and the requirement of re-register) to groups that were PRO Bernie or were in the "group" that would vote for Bernie.

No.3475635
File: Hillary_Cant_We_Go_Back.png - (590.81 KB, 1195x622) Thumbnail displayed, click image for full size.
604990

>>3475613

Oh, no, that's what he meant by "Bernie has no chance". The Democratic party only cares about the democratic party.

If you don't pay fealty and act obedient to the party leadership then you don't count as a real person so they will never let you win. Even if running on their ticket, they would rather lose than win with someone they can't control.

It's like Clinton said in her book, "He wasn't there to help a democrat win."
They literally consider the democratic leadership to be "the party", not the voters.

No.3475722

>>3475577

They only allow those who actually purchased and read the book to write a review. It's pretty common for Amazon to do that with controversial books.

No.3475852

>>3475635

Meanwhile.. in Trumpland.

New funding plans pretty much penalizes Democratic states and gives big boosts to GOP states.

https://twitter.com/TopherSpiro/status/908065558649851906

Also this explains aufy's and other hardcore trumpists..

www.theroot.com/new-poll-finds-majority-oppose-white-supremacists-even-18090721101

And good ol' Trump giving great service by staying every weekend in Mar A Lago...
https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/taxpayers-billed-1092-for-an-officials-two-night-stay-at-trumps-mar-a-lago-club/2017/09/15/e3e5dfdc-97c6-11e7-82e4-f1076f6d6152_story.html?utm_term=.e9670e3f0a14


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